October 4, 2016-Two Years Later

[weams]

6 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Don't make me post the video.

Post it. 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, weams said:

Post it. 

 

[JR Oriole]

I will be interested to see how the former Os do in the playoffs going forward.  Especially Schoop and Machado.  Although the sample size of playoff plate appearances is relatively small at 28 and 27 respectively, their numbers are pretty awful.  Given the quality of the teams they are on and another chance at October, they both really need to take advantage and hit like they are capable.  I am pulling for them both.

[luismatos4prez]

1 minute ago, Palmoripken said:

Agreed. Made no sense to not extend Miller but to extend O'Day.

Fielding the best team possible is the #1 goal, but I think there's value in being an extension-happy franchise. If you have guy who's a clubhouse leader and well-liked by the fans, it makes a lot of sense to keep him. I believe ODay was appropriately cheaper than Miller, too.

My mom is a casual Orioles fan. She gets sad when some of the few names she remembers go away. It makes her less interested. Mussina, Markakis, Machado leaving definitely have a negative effect on those type of fans.

I always root for productive Orioles to be extended. Within reason of course - even I was appalled at Chris Davis's contract. But I wanted Jones, Trumbo, Machado, Markakis, Cruz, all those guys signed to extensions within reason. I think it's a good way to do business as a mid-market club.

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, luismatos4prez said:

Fielding the best team possible is the #1 goal, but I think there's value in being an extension-happy franchise. If you have guy who's a clubhouse leader and well-liked by the fans, it makes a lot of sense to keep him. I believe ODay was appropriately cheaper than Miller, too.

My mom is a casual Orioles fan. She gets sad when some of the few names she remembers go away. It makes her less interested. Mussina, Markakis, Machado leaving definitely have a negative effect on those type of fans.

I always root for productive Orioles to be extended. Within reason of course - even I was appalled at Chris Davis's contract. But I wanted Jones, Trumbo, Machado, Markakis, Cruz, all those guys signed to extensions within reason. I think it's a good way to do business as a mid-market club.

It is when you sign them to deal years before they hit free agency.  I approved of both the Jones and Markakis contracts.  I wish they had locked up Manny and Schoop early.

If is NOT a good idea for a mid-market club to sign guys to long term deals at free agent rates.

And the Trumbo deal was a gross overpay considering what the market was like for his type of player.

[Palmoripken]

7 minutes ago, luismatos4prez said:

Fielding the best team possible is the #1 goal, but I think there's value in being an extension-happy franchise. If you have guy who's a clubhouse leader and well-liked by the fans, it makes a lot of sense to keep him. I believe ODay was appropriately cheaper than Miller, too.

My mom is a casual Orioles fan. She gets sad when some of the few names she remembers go away. It makes her less interested. Mussina, Markakis, Machado leaving definitely have a negative effect on those type of fans.

I always root for productive Orioles to be extended. Within reason of course - even I was appalled at Chris Davis's contract. But I wanted Jones, Trumbo, Machado, Markakis, Cruz, all those guys signed to extensions within reason. I think it's a good way to do business as a mid-market club.

I do hear ya. I just think middle relievers like O'Day are the most volatile parts of a roster. They can be so great one minute and out of baseball the next. And I loved O'Day. I was a submariner myself and you are right about the big names leaving. My Mom is a big Schoop fan herself. She was sad when I told him that him and Manny were gone because she loved their chemistry together. It's tough finding who is right to extend and who is right to keep. That's why not every team succeeds and why some do. I don't think there's a precise science to it. You just have to find the pieces that work.

 

[SteveA]

3 hours ago, JR Oriole said:

It hurt not only because I felt like 2014 really was our year, but I agree it was also because of the Royals.  Somehow they became the team to root for even though our pennant drought was actually longer than theirs.  They also were 100% healthy and we were missing key guys.  And their very timely defense and dink and dunk hits really ticked me off.  Just a miserable end to a phenomenal season.  Same with 1997 and almost the same storyline....an inferior AL Central opponent knocks us off on our path to glory!  1996 was a lot of fun, but not as much as 2012. 

I really don't even think of 2016 as the last hurrah.  For me, it really ended in the winter after the 2014 season when we decided to let Markakis, Cruz, and Miller go.  I understand the decisions, but I really don't care at all about the team's finances.  Let the employees worry about that.  I just want to win. 

And don't forget the Royals were down something like 5 runs in the 8th inning of the wild card game to the A's.   Oakland had a 97% win probability.   If KC doesn't make that miracle comeback, we would have faced the winner of an A's / Angels ALDS in the ALCS.   I think there's a good chance the 2014 O's win that series and go to the World Series.

[Moshagge3]

Easy to forget, but Zach Britton's short postseason career (just 2014) is not exactly illustrious. In 2014, he nearly blew a 2-0 lead in the clinching game of the ALDS. He was fortunate that the Tigers' starting catcher had left with an injury and they were left to send up a scrub who hit into the game-ending DP with the tying run in scoring position. In Game 1 of the ALCS he got into a bases loaded, no outs jam in Game 1 that Darren O'Day bailed him out of. Then he went out and lost Game 2. So his performance last night wasn't unprecedented. 

Do you think we would have felt worse if Zach Britton had given up the winning runs to Toronto in 2016? At least we were used to being angry at Ubaldo.

[TGO]

5 minutes ago, Moshagge3 said:

Easy to forget, but Zach Britton's short postseason career (just 2014) is not exactly illustrious. In 2014, he nearly blew a 2-0 lead in the clinching game of the ALDS. He was fortunate that the Tigers' starting catcher had left with an injury and they were left to send up a scrub who hit into the game-ending DP with the tying run in scoring position. In Game 1 of the ALCS he got into a bases loaded, no outs jam in Game 1 that Darren O'Day bailed him out of. Then he went out and lost Game 2. So his performance last night wasn't unprecedented. 

Do you think we would have felt worse if Zach Britton had given up the winning runs to Toronto in 2016? At least we were used to being angry at Ubaldo.

I don't think we would have felt worse. It still would have sucked, but if you lose with your best pitcher on the mound, so be it. Like Buck says, you have to tip your cap to the other guy. You don't leave your best pitcher in the bullpen in a sudden death situation.

[weams]

2 hours ago, Moshagge3 said:

Easy to forget, but Zach Britton's short postseason career (just 2014) is not exactly illustrious. In 2014, he nearly blew a 2-0 lead in the clinching game of the ALDS. He was fortunate that the Tigers' starting catcher had left with an injury and they were left to send up a scrub who hit into the game-ending DP with the tying run in scoring position. In Game 1 of the ALCS he got into a bases loaded, no outs jam in Game 1 that Darren O'Day bailed him out of. Then he went out and lost Game 2. So his performance last night wasn't unprecedented. 

Do you think we would have felt worse if Zach Britton had given up the winning runs to Toronto in 2016? At least we were used to being angry at Ubaldo.

Zach gave up the home run in the wild card game. 

[25 Nuggets]

6 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

 

Matt Mulholland is an internet legend!

[Moshagge3]

Another thought: if the "bullpenning" strategy had been a thing two years ago, do the Orioles start Brad Brach and ride him, O'Day, Givens, Hart and Britton to a 2-0 victory?

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Moshagge3 said:

Another thought: if the "bullpenning" strategy had been a thing two years ago, do the Orioles start Brad Brach and ride him, O'Day, Givens, Hart and Britton to a 2-0 victory?

It was being discussed two years ago but Buck isn't the guy to go first with something like that.

[sportsfan8703]

18 hours ago, atomic said:

Britton of 2018 isn't Britton of 2016. 

Exactly. 

First, Ubaldo should have never been anywhere near that game. 

Second, you put Britton in and ride him as long as he can go. 

We fell apart on that date. You have to have talent, but look at the Nats and Dodgers. Those teams believed and Buck and overperformed big time. Buck messed up. I forgive. I’m sure the team does too, but probably not in the 2017 season. 

Put it like this, Buck put a guy in that in early 2017 was in tears in a post game interview because he had a quality start, in an NL ballpark, with the P batting, to a team that lost nearly 100 games. He pitched that guy because it wasn’t a “save situation”. 

Look at the pens now. Britton should’ve pitched that game. I don’t care if it was right after Tillman. 

[atomic]

5 hours ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Exactly. 

First, Ubaldo should have never been anywhere near that game. 

Second, you put Britton in and ride him as long as he can go. 

 We fell apart on that date. You have to have talent, but look at the Nats and Dodgers. Those teams believed and Buck and overperformed big time. Buck messed up. I forgive. I’m sure the team does too, but probably not in the 2017 season. 

 Put it like this, Buck put a guy in that in early 2017 was in tears in a post game interview because he had a quality start, in an NL ballpark, with the P batting, to a team that lost nearly 100 games. He pitched that guy because it wasn’t a “save situation”. 

 Look at the pens now. Britton should’ve pitched that game. I don’t care if it was right after Tillman. 

Yeah pitching him any time in that game would have been fine.  Pitching Jiminez only when every other option has been used.  One of the biggest coaching blunders of all time and the team  has never recovered from it.  Buck should have been fired after that game.