How does Elias maintain a Top 10 farm system without high draft choices

[OFFNY]

1 hour ago, BohKnowsBmore said:

 

Was not a 15-year MiLB career. He got a cup of coffee in 2006 and exceeded rookie limits in 2007. He didn't start play in the minors until 2000 in his age 21 season. Not sure of the exact math, but he either used his maximum number of options or had to be exposed to the Rule-5 Draft at some point. 

The system isn't perfect, but I he wasn't a 15-year Minor Leaguer.

 

o

 

In fact, he had a long Major League career in which he made more than $44 Million.

He got to play in 2 World Series, winning one of them.

He also finished in the Top-25 for MVP in 3 consecutive years (2010, 2011, and 2012.)

 

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/ruizca01.shtml

 

Now perhaps he should have been granted free agency sooner than 15 years after he signed his first professional contract, but it's not like he was victimized by the system in the manner in which teams such as the St. Louis Cardinals would stash a lot of Major League-caliber players in their farm system by having as many as 3 AAA teams back in the 30's and 40's (prior to 1946, AA was essentially the equivalent of AAA) ........ at worst, Ruiz was a proverbial "well-paid slave." ) *

 

* )) A phrase coined by Curt Flood, when asked how he could call himself a slave when his salary was $90,000 a year in 1970.

 

 

 

o

[HowAboutThat]

1 hour ago, BohKnowsBmore said:

 

Was not a 15 year MiLB career. Got a cup of coffee in 2006 and exceeded rookie limits in 2007. He didn't start play in the minors until 2000 in his age 21 season. Not sure of the exact math but he either used his maximum number of options or had to be exposed to the R5 at some point. 

System isn't perfect, but he wasn't a 15-year minor leaguer.

OK, that was the impression I got, but my point stands, if you start the clock when you sign a player, that provides incentive to bring him up as early as he is ready and not dilly-dally over service time BS.

It also insures that a player Reaches free agency at a younger age, which means more extensions and better contracts in FA.

[OFFNY]

o

 

Perhaps the ultimate irony of the Carlos Ruiz situation is that when he was FINALLY granted free agency from the the Phillies, the team that had owned his right for the previous 15 years, he signed with ....... the Philadelphia Phillies !!! )  ) 

 

o

[DrungoHazewood]

3 hours ago, BohKnowsBmore said:

 

Was not a 15 year MiLB career. Got a cup of coffee in 2006 and exceeded rookie limits in 2007. He didn't start play in the minors until 2000 in his age 21 season. Not sure of the exact math but he either used his maximum number of options or had to be exposed to the R5 at some point. 

System isn't perfect, but he wasn't a 15-year minor leaguer.

No, but he had 15 years between signing and free agency.  At least he was an amateur free agent.  If he'd been drafted it would have been 15 years before he had any choice at all in where he played.

[DrungoHazewood]

2 hours ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

In fact, he had a long Major League career in which he made more than $44 Million.

He got to play in 2 World Series, winning one of them.

He also finished in the Top-25 for MVP in 3 consecutive years (2010, 2011, and 2012.)

 

https://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/ruizca01.shtml

 

Now perhaps he should have been granted free agency sooner than 15 years after he signed his first professional contract, but it's not like he was victimized by the system in the manner in which teams such as the St. Louis Cardinals would stash a lot of Major League-caliber players in their farm system by having as many as 3 AAA teams back in the 30's and 40's (prior to 1946, AA was essentially the equivalent of AAA) ........ at worst, Ruiz was a proverbial "well-paid slave." ) *

 

* )) A phrase coined by Curt Flood, when asked how he could call himself a slave when his salary was $90,000 a year in 1970.

 

 

 

o

Certainly even the worst excesses of today are not on the level of the pre-free agency era when you could sign at 17 and have no choice in your employer (besides quitting baseball) until you retire.

[OFFNY]

12 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

 

Certainly, even the worst excesses of today are not on the level of the pre-free agency era, when you could sign at 17 years-old and have no choice in your employer (besides quitting baseball) until you retire.

 

o

 

Good point. 

I completely agree.

 

o

[NedFromYork]

I don't see MLB using this year's record by itself for draft order.

[Can_of_corn]

4 minutes ago, NedFromYork said:

I don't see MLB using this year's record by itself for draft order.

Red Sox could end up with the #1 pick.  Wouldn't that draw some eyes to the draft?

[OFFNY]

14 minutes ago, NedFromYork said:

 

I don't see MLB using this year's record by itself for draft order.

 

o

 

 

 

In 1977, Billy Martin allegedly picked a lineup out of a hat when the Yankees were struggling.

I'm not sure that I buy it, though.

I think that it's more than just a coincidence that Willie Randolph wound up leading off instead of Mickey Rivers. Randolph was the second fastest Yankee on the team, and was the next logical choice to bat lead-off in the event of a change.

Also, Reggie Jackson batting 3rd instead of 4th, Craig Nettles (power hitter) batting cleanup instead of 3rd or 5th ........ with the exception of Mickey Rivers batting 5th and Chris Chambliss batting 8th, it just seems too sane of a lineup to have been randomly picked out of a hat.

I think that if Martin had REALLY picked the lineup out of a hat, we would have seen something like Munson leading off, Bucky Dent batting cleanup, Reggie Jackson batting 8th or 9th, etc.

 

Martin's "Hat-Picked" Lineup:

 

Willie Randolph - 2B

Thurman Munson - C

Reggie Jackson - RF

Graig Nettles - 3B

Mickey Rivers - CF

Roy White - LF

Carlos May - DH

Chris Chambliss - 1B

Bucky Dent - SS

 

http://www.baseball-reference.com/boxes/NYA/NYA197704210.shtml

 

o

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

13 minutes ago, NedFromYork said:

I don't see MLB using this year's record by itself for draft order.

Report: MLB hasn't decided how to set 2021 draft order

Teams have not heard from the league on whether the draft process will be changed in 2021 or if options beyond using winning percentage to determine selection order may be considered, multiple sources told The Athletic's Stephen J. Nesbitt.

Under normal circumstances, the team with the lowest winning percentage in a given season picks first overall in the following year's draft. But the March agreement between MLB and the Major League Baseball Players Association gave commissioner Rob Manfred the power to "modify the draft order" in 2021 if the 2020 season was shorter than 81 games, according to Nesbitt.

[Frobby]

6 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

Red Sox could end up with the #1 pick.  Wouldn't that draw some eyes to the draft?

Yeah.   25 people would watch the first 15 minutes, instead of the usual 12 people.    Huge money maker for MLB there.   

More accurately, 611,000 people watched the first round of the draft this year, about double the normal number because there were no live sports going on at the time in the US.
 

[NedFromYork]

The most logical and fairest approach to me is to combine last year's and this year's records, then sort lowest WP to highest for draft order and I think that is what they will do.

[Roll Tide]

How in the world did a thread about the 2021 draft turn into a conversation about Curt Flood?

 

 

[Can_of_corn]

7 minutes ago, Roll Tide said:

How in the world did a thread about the 2021 draft turn into a conversation about Curt Flood?

 

 

Are you new around these parts? 

[Can_of_corn]

7 hours ago, Frobby said:

Yeah.   25 people would watch the first 15 minutes, instead of the usual 12 people.    Huge money maker for MLB there.   

More accurately, 611,000 people watched the first round of the draft this year, about double the normal number because there were no live sports going on at the time in the US.
 

Only because MLB can't market to save their lives.

It could be a golden opportunity to get eyes on the draft.