If the Os were to be buyers…

[OriolesMagic83]

15 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

1-2 injuries to the rotations and this is a train wreck. Baumann, Lowther, and Kremer would be forced into action. 

I think Kremer is about to be forced into the rotation.  What other options do the O's have.  I think Harvey's suspension is up the end of June, but he will likely be worse than last year.  Really poor planning by the O's.  A MLB team can't go into the season w/o starters on standby to take rotation spots.  The Mets have lost Scherzer, DeGrom and Megill and have still be plugging along. The O's had no plan if things went wrong.  Harvey in AAA (they knew he would get suspended), is not a plan.

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I think Kremer is about to be forced into the rotation.  What other options do the O's have.  I think Harvey's suspension is up the end of June, but he will likely be worse than last year.  Really poor planning by the O's.  A MLB team can't go into the season w/o starters on standby to take rotation spots.  The Mets have lost Scherzer, DeGrom and Megill and have still be plugging along. The O's had no plan if things went wrong.  Harvey in AAA (they knew he would get suspended), is not a plan.

It's not as if they had no plan.

Elias doesn't care about winning so it wasn't in his best interest to acquire usable depth.

The plan is throw whatever body they can scrap together on the cheap at the problem.  \

Same plan he's had from 2019-2021.

[OriolesMagic83]

9 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

It's not as if they had no plan.

Elias doesn't care about winning so it wasn't in his best interest to acquire usable depth.

The plan is throw whatever body they can scrap together on the cheap at the problem.  \

Same plan he's had from 2019-2021.

I hope he's put on notice that winning is the priority in 2023 and going forward.  But that would require owners that care more about winning that making money.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

34 minutes ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I hope he's put on notice that winning is the priority in 2023 and going forward.  But that would require owners that care more about winning that making money.

I don’t think that’s a safe assumption about ownership by any stretch. 

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

I don’t think that’s a safe assumption about ownership by any stretch. 

I think their main goal right now is to figure out how to spend that 600M to increase their revenue.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think their main goal right now is to figure out how to spend that 600M to increase their revenue.

That I can agree on. 

[btdart20]

I'm ok trading anyone.  Especially the usual suspects:  Mancini, Santander, Lyles, Mullins, Bautista, and Lopez should have some type of value (however minimal).  But if we're "buying" for 2023, then Mullins and one of Bautista/Lopez stays.  

Guys I would say are keepers:  Rutschman, Grayson, Gunnar, Hall, Hays, Westburg.  

Guys I would say are more valuable to the O's than elsewhere:  Mateo, Akin, Tate, and would probably put underperforming/injured MiLB guys in here (Kjerstad, Baumler, Cowser, Mayo, Pinto...).  Means probably falls here too because no one's buying an injured SP.  Lyles could fall here if we're building for 2023, but trade him if we're looking beyond 2023.  Mountcastle probably falls here.  I put Mateo here because I like his athleticism and positional flexibility.

MiLB guys I'm fine with trading/shopping:  Stowers, Norby, Rhodes, Haskin, Rom, Bradish.  Honestly, I'm not as well educated, but was really just looking at org position depth (OF and 2B depth) compared to the 2023 FA class (lots of SPs and SS).  Stowers gives me the Gallo-vibes.  Haskin seem solid, but empty.  On the fence still with Rhodes.  I do like Norby a lot, but Prieto/Westburg/Vavra/Hernaiz...  Bradish could be really good, but if we're buying for 2023 then we likely have signed a FA #1 SP to go with Lyles/Grayson/Zimmermann (or have traded Lyles and can spending a #2 SP FA).

2023 would have:

SP - FA #1 (Manaea?  Musgrove?), Lyles, Grayson, Zimmermann, scab until Means/Hall. 

RP - Akin, Tate, and Bautista

C - AR

1B - Mounty

2B - Urias and Westburg at some point.

SS - FA 

3B - Scab until Gunnar

CF - Hays, Mateo

OF - Scab FA (decent cheap lefty options), Mateo, McKenna, Diaz and Neustrom - obviously the OF would shift from being a relative offensive strength, to a relative weakness.  But we'd be gaining elsewhere, even defensively.

2023 could be a wildcard contender adding $50-55m payroll.  Adding $70-75m would get a 2 TOR SPs and a top SS.  Payroll would stay under $100m (I think).

Plus, drafting Jones at 1.1.  And I wouldn't be shy about drafting multiple injured arms either.  Especially if they are first round talents that have fallen much later.  It's a crap shoot beyond pick 30 anyway, so why not go with an upside gamble that the arm recovers.

[sportsfan8703]

11 minutes ago, btdart20 said:

I'm ok trading anyone.  Especially the usual suspects:  Mancini, Santander, Lyles, Mullins, Bautista, and Lopez should have some type of value (however minimal).  But if we're "buying" for 2023, then Mullins and one of Bautista/Lopez stays.  

Guys I would say are keepers:  Rutschman, Grayson, Gunnar, Hall, Hays, Westburg.  

Guys I would say are more valuable to the O's than elsewhere:  Mateo, Akin, Tate, and would probably put underperforming/injured MiLB guys in here (Kjerstad, Baumler, Cowser, Mayo, Pinto...).  Means probably falls here too because no one's buying an injured SP.  Lyles could fall here if we're building for 2023, but trade him if we're looking beyond 2023.  Mountcastle probably falls here.  I put Mateo here because I like his athleticism and positional flexibility.

MiLB guys I'm fine with trading/shopping:  Stowers, Norby, Rhodes, Haskin, Rom, Bradish.  Honestly, I'm not as well educated, but was really just looking at org position depth (OF and 2B depth) compared to the 2023 FA class (lots of SPs and SS).  Stowers gives me the Gallo-vibes.  Haskin seem solid, but empty.  On the fence still with Rhodes.  I do like Norby a lot, but Prieto/Westburg/Vavra/Hernaiz...  Bradish could be really good, but if we're buying for 2023 then we likely have signed a FA #1 SP to go with Lyles/Grayson/Zimmermann (or have traded Lyles and can spending a #2 SP FA).

2023 would have:

SP - FA #1 (Manaea?  Musgrove?), Lyles, Grayson, Zimmermann, scab until Means/Hall. 

RP - Akin, Tate, and Bautista

C - AR

1B - Mounty

2B - Urias and Westburg at some point.

SS - FA 

3B - Scab until Gunnar

CF - Hays, Mateo

OF - Scab FA (decent cheap lefty options), Mateo, McKenna, Diaz and Neustrom - obviously the OF would shift from being a relative offensive strength, to a relative weakness.  But we'd be gaining elsewhere, even defensively.

2023 could be a wildcard contender adding $50-55m payroll.  Adding $70-75m would get a 2 TOR SPs and a top SS.  Payroll would stay under $100m (I think).

Plus, drafting Jones at 1.1.  And I wouldn't be shy about drafting multiple injured arms either.  Especially if they are first round talents that have fallen much later.  It's a crap shoot beyond pick 30 anyway, so why not go with an upside gamble that the arm recovers.

Should Grayson be the exact example of why not to draft pitching?  You identify and pick the kid over the much more heralded Liberatore. You handle him with care and watch him flourish. Then in his last AAA start he suffers an injury. I like drafting the bats. The bats just gotta perform. 
 

Right now we have a really good defense. A good bullpen. A potentially good lineup. No SP. We’ve won like that before but that’s tough. 

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Should Grayson be the exact example of why not to draft pitching?  You identify and pick the kid over the much more heralded Liberatore. You handle him with care and watch him flourish. Then in his last AAA start he suffers an injury. I like drafting the bats. The bats just gotta perform. 
 

Right now we have a really good defense. A good bullpen. A potentially good lineup. No SP. We’ve won like that before but that’s tough. 

I don't get how folks have just decided that he was going to get called up after that start.  It's speculation. 

Didn't most folks here think he was going to get called up before that start?

As for getting hurt, Adley got hurt in ST, Elias' first round pick in 2020 was a position player and he's yet to play a game as a pro.

How about he just draft long snappers?

[ChosenOne21]

37 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Should Grayson be the exact example of why not to draft pitching?  You identify and pick the kid over the much more heralded Liberatore. You handle him with care and watch him flourish. Then in his last AAA start he suffers an injury. I like drafting the bats. The bats just gotta perform. 
 

Right now we have a really good defense. A good bullpen. A potentially good lineup. No SP. We’ve won like that before but that’s tough. 

Jeez, it's a lat. He's going to be fine