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Does AM and Ownership Have the Pulse of the Fans?

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Mackus Hangout Grand Counsel

Mackus

Posted
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Have you SEEN these threads around here? People are basically arguing against improving the team by making quality free agent signings.
STOP MAKING STRAWMAN ARGUMENTS! At this point you are just flat out lying.

Nobody is against "quality" FA signings. We are against "suicidal" free agent signings.

Offering 5/$95M to Lackey would have been suicidal. Offering enough to beat the Cards offer to Holliday (rumored at 8/$128M) would be suicidal. If either of those deals don't work out, we'd be completely dead in the water.

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Roll Tide Hangout Grand Counsel

Roll Tide

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STOP MAKING STRAWMAN ARGUMENTS! At this point you are just flat out lying.

Nobody is against "quality" FA signings. We are against "suicidal" free agent signings.

Offering 5/$95M to Lackey would have been suicidal. Offering enough to beat the Cards offer to Holliday (rumored at 8/$128M) would be suicidal. If either of those deals don't work out, we'd be completely dead in the water.

OK ...and in a few years you'll be saying the same thing about Halladay, Fielder, Gonzalez & others.

So your basically DUG IN on not spending Market value for the top players. Basically saying youre not interested in them because they want too much money. So if we never sign any top talent we will always be in the lower tier in our division. This team sucks at drafting position talent. Forget Wieters as he was a no brainer & gift where we got him in the draft. This team hasnt grown a legitimate power hitter since Murray IMO .... Some of you will say Ripken (I dont consider 20 Homers a power hitter). This team has been searching for a power hitting 1B since Palmeiro left the 1st time & before siging him as a free agent they waited along time after Murray was traded.

So your not going to buy in free agency, Many here dont want to give up some of our top pitching talent that it will take to get what we wont buy & We cant seem to draft it.... Looks pretty bleak from where I'm standing.

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Mackus Hangout Grand Counsel

Mackus

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OK ...and in a few years you'll be saying the same thing about Halladay, Fielder, Gonzalez & others.
No I won't. Because in a few years, we get to reap the immediate benefit of those deals. Those extra 5-6 wins they'll give us in year one will likely take us from a 88ish win team to a 94ish win team. That's when its worth taking the risk.

When those extra 6 wins take you from 69 to 75 wins, or from 77 to 84, you're not getting that great immediate impact but you still have to stick around for the suckitude at the end of the deal.

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Old#5fan Hangout Grand Counsel

Old#5fan

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OK ...and in a few years you'll be saying the same thing about Halladay, Fielder, Gonzalez & others.

So your basically DUG IN on not spending Market value for the top players. Basically saying youre not interested in them because they want too much money. So if we never sign any top talent we will always be in the lower tier in our division. This team sucks at drafting position talent. Forget Wieters as he was a no brainer & gift where we got him in the draft. This team hasnt grown a legitimate power hitter since Murray IMO .... Some of you will say Ripken (I dont consider 20 Homers a power hitter). This team has been searching for a power hitting 1B since Palmeiro left the 1st time & before siging him as a free agent they waited along time after Murray was traded.

So your not going to buy in free agency, Many here dont want to give up some of our top pitching talent that it will take to get what we wont buy & We cant seem to draft it.... Looks pretty bleak from where I'm standing.

It is bleak. I am going on record that if McPhail doesn't sign or acquire a big bat at least of the aging varietly like Delgado or Vlad, and doesnt' add a marquee starter like say, Pedro Martinez, this team is going to be every bit as bad as it was last year and won't likely win any more games. In fact, they might well be worse!

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Lucky Jim Hangout Grand Counsel

Lucky Jim

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It is bleak. I am going on record that if McPhail doesn't sign or acquire a big bat at least of the aging varietly like Delgado or Vlad, and doesnt' add a marquee starter like say, Pedro Martinez, this team is going to be every bit as bad as it was last year and won't likely win any more games. In fact, they might well be worse!

Okay. If this doesn't happen, I'll make a bet with you:

If the Orioles aren't better than last year, I'll leave the board for a year.

If the Orioles are better, you leave the board for a year.

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Hank Scorpio Hangout Grand Counsel

Hank Scorpio

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It is bleak. I am going on record that if McPhail doesn't sign or acquire a big bat at least of the aging varietly like Delgado or Vlad, and doesnt' add a marquee starter like say, Pedro Martinez, this team is going to be every bit as bad as it was last year and won't likely win any more games. In fact, they might well be worse!

I love when you go on the record.

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PBR Street Gang Major Leaguer Cup of Coffee

PBR Street Gang

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Okay. If this doesn't happen, I'll make a bet with you:

If the Orioles aren't better than last year, I'll leave the board for a year.

If the Orioles are better, you leave the board for a year.

...and if the O's win exactly the same amount next year, then stat geeks can't use UZR to support their absurd defense hypothesis. :laughlol:

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DrungoHazewood Hangout Grand Counsel

DrungoHazewood

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OK ...and in a few years you'll be saying the same thing about Halladay, Fielder, Gonzalez & others.

So your basically DUG IN on not spending Market value for the top players. Basically saying youre not interested in them because they want too much money. So if we never sign any top talent we will always be in the lower tier in our division. This team sucks at drafting position talent. Forget Wieters as he was a no brainer & gift where we got him in the draft. This team hasnt grown a legitimate power hitter since Murray IMO .... Some of you will say Ripken (I dont consider 20 Homers a power hitter). This team has been searching for a power hitting 1B since Palmeiro left the 1st time & before siging him as a free agent they waited along time after Murray was traded.

So your not going to buy in free agency, Many here dont want to give up some of our top pitching talent that it will take to get what we wont buy & We cant seem to draft it.... Looks pretty bleak from where I'm standing.

After so many long threads on this topic how is it that you still think that not wanting the 2009 Orioles to sign a bunch of round-peg, square-hole free agents means that we think the O's should never sign anyone?

I'll spell it out for you, for the 9389489th time:

- Signing big ticket free agents when your baseline is 64 wins is a sure way to lose money in the short term and have millstone contracts weighing down the franchise at the end of the deals. John Lackey moving the O's record up 4 or 5 wins when they're a sub-.500 team will push attendance up about three dozen fans a game.

- It's expected that the O's will sign several top free agents when there is an existing foundation of .500+ baseball. Pushing an 80-85 win team up to 90+ wins brings with it hundreds of thousands of fans and a very good shot at tens of $millions in playoff revenues. In the real world, owners rarely spend years ahead of revenues because real people don't like flushing money down the toilet to appease casual fans.

It's really annoying that wanting to sign big players only when it counts is being portrayed as the position of a cheapskate and Angelos apologist who doesn't care if the O's lose forever.

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Lucky Jim Hangout Grand Counsel

Lucky Jim

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Make the bet just the entire off-season and define what you mean by "better" and I might agree to the bet. I mean to me 3 or four games more in the W column isn't significantly better.

I'm willing to go away if they're not better at all. They don't even need to be worse. Why aren't you willing to go away if they are better? Why does it have to suddenly be significant?

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