Will Ichiro get 3000?

[Orioles1954]

Yeah, I highly doubt he would be good enough to play in the Majors today.

I always hear the argument that great is great in any era, and I think that is probably inaccurate.

Cobb did not play against African-Americans, Latin Americans, Asians. Cobb broke into MLB in 1905, and the US population was roughly 83M. Today that population is over 300M.

Players are bigger, stronger, and better trained. If Cobb was born today, he would have the ability/use of all of the improvements in training. If he was pulled out of the prime of his career, and placed into MLB today; I imagine he would be physically lacking.

Yes, I know he was over 6 feet tall, and around 180 lbs.

Yes, I know some of the physical advances of the modern player are tainted by the Steroid era.

Still, in 1900 the Olympic record in the 100M dash was 11 seconds flat. In 2008 the Olympic record in the 100M dash was 9.69 seconds.

You say different sports, I say evidence of the top athletes of today just being superior.

Now just comparing numbers becomes difficult as well. Besides the differences in competition, and how the games were played (innings of starters, vs. specialization of today) you also have to account for travel differences, lighting, field conditions etc etc.

Very hard to compare eras, and I respect what he accomplished in his; I just highly doubt you could take him from his era, and have him be able to compete today.

My guess is that Cobb would not be as good as Felix Pie.

One small, teensy problem with your laughable assertion. If you put Cobb in today's MLB, he would have had access to all of the specialization and training that athletes today enjoy. Also, top athletes of yesteryear chose baseball first. Today, baseball is the third choice amongst American athletes.

[Moose Milligan]

No, hand/eye coordination is and has always been a part of baseball.... but if the competition is better today (and there is every reason to believe it is), that likely also means a higher degree of hand/eye coordination is needed to succeed in the current game.

The only way you can prove this is to prove that pitching is tougher today than it was back then. Yes, today's pitchers are probably bigger and stronger than the ones from back then but who is to say that the old timers had a worse feel for pitching? By that I mean, who's to say that someone from 1910 couldn't break off a curveball as good as someone today? Carl Hubbel threw a screwball that no one even throws today.

I can't imagine that (as touched on a moment ago) that a slider today breaks tougher than a spitball/shineball/scuffball in 1910. 95 MPH back then is still the same 95 that it is today. In order to prove your assertion you have to prove to me and others that pitchers were able to put less movement on the ball back then compared to how pitchers make it move today.

[GoldGlove21]

There is good chance that the best athletics in the USA don't even play baseball. That wasn't the case in the 1920s.

Look at Babe Ruth. Was he really the best athlete during his time? Ruth used a 42" bat that weighed 42 ounces. To put that into perspective Barry Bonds used a 33" bat that weighed 35 ounces. Barry Bonds was clearly stronger than Ruth and a better athlete, but he needed a bat that was 7 ounces lighter than Ruth's? That would likely be because players didn't throw as hard as they do now.

If someone can say that Pujols is a better power hitter than Ruth then I can say that Ichiro is a better hitter at putting a ball in play than Cobb was. I think Pujols is the better overall player because it is insane to have as much power as Pujols while keeping a batting average in the .320 range most years.

[Orioles1954]

The talent pool of America in 2010 in considerably larger than 1905 America... and when combine that additional talent-pool with the Latin, and Asian talent; there is no doubt that the competition is far superior today.

And there were far fewer teams then, where available talent was pooled and not diluted. It's apples and oranges.

[Orioles1954]

I am sure he, and Robinson, and Koufax, and Gibson would each be players today and all still succeed. I just think to a lesser degree.

We can't ignore the performance enhancement drugs which has made these players look a lot better than what they are.

[PitchingWins]

I agree, that is what the crux of the argument boils down to. I am comfortable with the idea that if the talent-pool is greater, and that players are athletically superior today... that correspondingly there is a greater quantity of quality pitching and performance today.

I'm sure there were plenty of pitchers that threw 95 in 1905. I am guessing there are more today. I can freely admit that is a guess, but logically it makes sense.

Someone will respond that throwing 95 is not the sole basis of pitching. Obviously, and I totally agree. My point is that whatever criteria you are using (movement, poise, secondary pitches, just overall ability) I am guessing there exists better quantity and quality today. Again, it is a guess... I admit that... but I see no reason to think the logic is wrong either.

I am with you for the most part. I think Cobb would break into the ML. Do i think he is faster than Carl Crawford? No. Do I think he would be on the fasted players in baseball? Not a chance. I think their were probably guys who could throw the ball 95 MPH in 1905. I don't think they had the knowledge pitchers do now though. There simply wasn't information available like there is now. I don't know how fast the internet was in 1905 but now it is pretty quick. They can watch game footage 5 seconds after it happens. Todays athletes are far superior there is just no way around it. I am not saying Johnny Unitas was a bum, but I think if both in their prime Ray Lewis would snap him in half in .05 seconds. The football field is the same length, but todays quarterbacks throw the ball harder, faster, straighter, tighter whatever you want to say. Just as baseball players throw harder, better, less often. You don't think having a pitcher go 9 innings takes a toll on his arm? 200 pitches sure seems like a lot to me. I would think the ball would get straight and lifeless. Making it easier to hit. for everyone which equates to more appearances for Cobb at the plate.