Nyjer Morgan

[BaltimoreTerp]

100% true. The hit on the Marlins catcher was NOT dirty.

Is this supposed to be oxymoronic?

[Arthur_Bryant]

BTW, does anyone know if Morgan has always been like this or if this is something that's developed recently.

He has always been aggressive and played with emotion, but he has been over the top lately.

[ledzepp8]

I tend to agree with you on this whole thing, unless (and this is a huge unless) he was doing something unnecessary such as sliding excessively hard into the bases as he was stealing and/or was running his mouth an excessive amount while on bases. Having said that, I still don't agree with throwing at, or behind, hittters.

I'd say that even if he was jawing at them as he was stealing bases (and yes it would be lame), it comes back to the Marlins starting it by throwing at him. I don't have a huge problem with them throwing at him but they can't very well throw at him and then whine because he reacts in a certain manner.

[ledzepp8]

The baserunner also has the right to run straight through first base. If you have a clean single it's unnecessary, and in the case of an error potentially costly.

Just because the runner is "allowed" to do something, doesn't mean they should.

More like the "she took the roofies herself" defense.

I really don't understand what this has to do with anything. If your point is that Morgan would have been better off sliding because he probably would have safe, then that's probably true. But in that instant, Morgan has to make up his mind what he's going to do and doesn't know where the ball is going to be. Bottomline is that the ball got to the catcher before Morgan collided with him. It wasn't dirty and was a closer play than you guys are trying to make it out to be.

As for your last point we're going to have to just disagree. Nothing has come out to the contrary, and so all we have to go on is that the Marlins were mad that Morgan was stealing bases, in other words, playing baseball. Blid even posted a quote from Gaby Sanchez saying that was the reason they were mad at him.

[ledzepp8]

Is this supposed to be oxymoronic?

How exactly was it dirty? Is there now some unwritten rule that says when a runner can collide with a catcher?

The only reason people get so up in arms about it these days is because most players are too scared to do it, so it's very rare to actually see happen.

[blid]

He made his point by stealing the bases; no reason to stir things up further by running his mouth. You also overlooked the part about him possibly sliding excessively hard.

The bottom line is there's plenty of blame to go around for both sides, and then some.

But Gaby Sanchez says it was just for stealing bases while losing in his quote. The Marlins are just dumb, we don't need to make up things like jawing and "excessive sliding."

[ledzepp8]

He made his point by stealing the bases; no reason to stir things up further by running his mouth. You also overlooked the part about him possibly sliding excessively hard.

The bottom line is there's plenty of blame to go around for both sides, and then some.

Yeah I agree with this. I just don't think that it was anything other than him having the audacity to steal bases down by 11, especially after reading the Gaby Sanchez quote that Blid provided.

[BaltimoreTerp]

Since this basically comes down to you guys being willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and us others not, I don't think this argument can go anywhere else.

[blid]

Since this basically comes down to you guys being willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and us others not, I don't think this argument can go anywhere else.

But Gaby Sanchez said straight out that it was just for stealing at all, where's the doubt coming from?

[ledzepp8]

Since this basically comes down to you guys being willing to give him the benefit of the doubt and us others not, I don't think this argument can go anywhere else.

What benefit of the doubt? Gaby Sanchez was quoted as saying it was due to him stealing bases when down by 11, after being hit by a pitch. That seems to be pretty cut and dry.

[Tony-OH]

100% true. The hit on the Marlins catcher was NOT dirty. Then they hit him with a pitch.

Well, stealing bases is a good way to get back at getting hit by a pitch. And even in the book "Baseball Codes," there's no mention of an unwritten rule against stealing bases while DOWN.

And then they threw at him a second time?? Not that charging the mound is a good thing, but they threw at him twice and Volstad obviously was looking for the brawl, dropping his glove and getting ready.

There's definitely some racial aspects to the media criticism imo. Does anyone ever call Utley a thug for running into catchers? Eckstein and Pierzynski are "scrappy."

The only thing Morgan has done that I think was wrong was veering into and pushing the Cardinals catcher, and even that was never going to hurt anyone.

Puhlease! There is nothing racist about people calling Morgan a punk for his actions. He's the definition of a punk. He's the kind of guy that tries to inflict harm to his opponents and doesn't respect the game or the fans that pay to watch him.

White or black, this guy deserves everything that is coning to him and more.

[Tony-OH]

How exactly was it dirty? Is there now some unwritten rule that says when a runner can collide with a catcher?

The only reason people get so up in arms about it these days is because most players are too scared to do it, so it's very rare to actually see happen.

He did not need to collide with the catcher. The catcher WAS NOT blocking the plate. He easily could have slid and should have. It's borderline but if this was his only transgression I don't think we would be having this conversation. When you add into all the other punk stuff this idiot has been up to is when you assume it was dirty.

[blid]

He would have been better off sliding but the collision wasn't dirty. Keep in mind, of course, that Nyjer Morgan is a hockey player first and foremost. I think that explains why he's not afraid of physical contact. Nyjer playing baseball is like Happy Gilmore playing golf. :laughlol:

http://content.usatoday.com/communities/gameon/post/2010/09/nyjer-morgan-hockey-brawl-nationals-marlins/1

[SammyBirdland]

Gaby Sanchez: "I mean I just took it as, we hit him the first time, I think we're up by eleven at that point in time and when he got to first he ends up stealing second and then stealing third, down by eleven. And that's the whole gist of the conversation, you know I heard, you really don't do that in baseball."

So what is the minimum run deficit where the unwritten rules require you to roll over and give up? That's the freaking stupidest thing I have ever heard in my life. It's not like there is a time limit. If you start hitting in the bottom of the 9th inning and score 11 runs, you win!

You play to win the game.

<object width="480" height="385"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMk5sMHj58I?fs=1&hl=en_US"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMk5sMHj58I?fs=1&hl=en_US" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="480" height="385"></embed></object>

[Arthur_Bryant]

First off, I'm not making things up. Read what I wrote and you'll see the word IF. The reason for stating those things were possible is that earlier in the thread someone mentioned that he was running his mouth after he got on base. Someone else mentioned that his slide may have been too aggressive - thus the use of the word IF. I believe another of the players were quoted as saying he was running his mouth too much.

I have only seen the stolen bases sequence once, but the slides were nothing out of the ordinary to me, and if I remember correctly he had a chance to take out the fielder on at least one of them (at 3B) but he came in clean.

I have no idea whether he was mouthing off. It wouldn't surprise me if he was.