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Deadwood Fan

By Deadwood Fan
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wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
14 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Gausman had pretty much the same season that Tillman, Gonzo, Chen and Norris had in 2014.  Just take 12 of his starts in the minors and make them 10 more starts in the majors.  Norris made 28 starts, you only need to replace 18 more.

I find it very hard to believe that whatever warm bodies the O's would have dredged up couldn't hold a 12 game lead for 18 starts.

Who kidding who?  Only need 18 more starts at a 3.65 ERA.   The O's have no one like that right now.  Its not that easy to come up with that and who has to be traded to get someone like that. Who knows if Gausman could have done 28 starts in the majors in 2014.    

Norris was valuable in 2014 and he helped the O's to their best season in 20 years.   I don't agree with trying to minimizing that.

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

Posted
Posted
2 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Who kidding who?  Only need 18 more starts at a 3.65 ERA.   The O's have no one like that right now.  Its not that easy to come up with that and who has to be traded to get someone like that. Who knows if Gausman could have done 28 starts in the majors in 2014.    

Norris was valuable in 2014 and he helped the O's to their best season in 20 years.   I don't agree with trying to minimizing that.

He did 20!  He was pretty much the same as Norris! 

Why would they need 18 more starts at a 3.65 ERA?  They didn't need to duplicate their season they just needed to win the division.  They beat the Yankees by 12 games!

Norris had a decent enough year in 2014.  He wasn't the deciding factor in that team winning the division.

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wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
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5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

He did 20!  He was pretty much the same as Norris! 

Why would they need 18 more starts at a 3.65 ERA?  They didn't need to duplicate their season they just needed to win the division.  They beat the Yankees by 12 games!

Norris had a decent enough year in 2014.  He wasn't the deciding factor in that team winning the division.

Never said he was the difference maker.  He was an important starter.   If he was replaced it would have cost something.  Probably something the O's did not have.

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Il BuonO Hangout Grand Counsel

Il BuonO

Posted
Posted
1 hour ago, wildcard said:

Pay attention.  Frobby said  "He was admittedly pretty good in 2014, though I'm pretty confident we would have won the division without him." 

I want to know who would had replaced him.   Gausman has not had that kind on season yet. 

Easy tiger, I often leave out emoticons. Tongue in cheek, k?

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foxfield Hangout Grand Counsel

foxfield

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4 hours ago, Cumberbundy said:

It's relevant, time doesn't make it less so, unless you're desperate to defend the indefensible. Your understanding is the we've lost a lot of talent for nothing & Duq gave a cy young award winner away because he mistook his lack of knowledge for actual knowledge. It's my understanding that Harvey & Bundy were injured despite Duqs brilliance. It's my understanding that Bridwell is having a nice year now that he's away from Duqs ignorance. That's history, history of incompetence & the reason we're on the outside looking in. Duq has created more wins for the Cubs & Brewers than he has for us. He's a disaster. History, years of trying to find a single decent starter & a failure to get one. The worst GM in the game. 

You are entitled to your opinions as all on here are, but not your own facts.  The bold is wrong and you know it, saying it weakens your argument, it does not make it stronger.  And it should be worth noting that Duquette came here after most of the hot shots in baseball told the O's to go to hell.  So the expectation that he would be better than average coming in should have been pretty low.  Of course that won't change my judgement of his tenure, which in my opinion is incomplete but hovering quite a bit above yours, even setting aside the above hyperbole. ;) 

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Frobby Hangout Grand Counsel

Frobby

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3 hours ago, wildcard said:

Use what every you want.  Norris was certainly better the Ubaldo in 2014.   Norris had more starts, more innings, better WHIP and  a lower average against then Gonzo.   Norris was the O's #3 in 2014 based on results.   

Gausman has yet to have as good a season has Norris had in 2014.

We won the division by 12 games. Maybe if Morris isn't there we win by 7-8.    We still win easily without him IMO.

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wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
17 minutes ago, Frobby said:

We won the division by 12 games. Maybe if Morris isn't there we win by 7-8.    We still win easily without him IMO.

Or maybe if Norris is not there the O's lose a lot more games.  We will never know.  But what we do know is the Norris played a big role on the best team the  O's have had this century.

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eddie83 Hangout Grand Counsel

eddie83

Posted
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23 minutes ago, Frobby said:

We won the division by 12 games. Maybe if Morris isn't there we win by 7-8.    We still win easily without him IMO.

True but you could take any starter out of the team that year and say that. They don't win 96 games without him.  

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

Posted
Posted
3 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Or maybe if Norris is not there the O's lose a lot more games.  We will never know.  But what we do know is the Norris played a big role on the best team the  O's have had this century.

I'm sure that Norris not being there would cause Chen, Tillman, and Gonzo to lose a lot more of their starts.  Moral support and all that.

 

Norris wasn't appreciably better than any starter other than Ubaldo.

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eddie83 Hangout Grand Counsel

eddie83

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9 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

They didn't need to win 96 games.

So? That makes no sense to me at all. Who in the hell goes into a season saying so and so can have a bad year and we can win anyway? Bud's year should not be penalized because another team wasn't neck and neck with the Orioles.

The Dodgers didn't need Alex Wood this year to win the division. 

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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Posted
7 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

So? That makes no sense to me at all. Who in the hell goes into a season saying so and so can have a bad year and we can win anyway? Bud's year should not be penalized because another team wasn't neck and neck with the Orioles.

The Dodgers didn't need Alex Wood this year to win the division. 

It matters if folks say that the O's needed Norris.  They didn't.  The team was good enough without him.  Maybe if he hadn't been terrible in 2015 they make the playoffs?

He wasn't great in 2014, he was above average.

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wildcard Hangout Grand Counsel

wildcard

Posted
Posted
7 hours ago, Frobby said:

We won the division by 12 games. Maybe if Morris isn't there we win by 7-8.    We still win easily without him IMO.

Using that logic you could say the O's didn't need Tillman or Chen.  You could probably say they didn't need Manny.  But why would you want to?

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