Jump to content

MLB CBA/Labor Dispute Thread


SteveA

Recommended Posts

3 hours ago, osfan83 said:

Well, there is no way to prove it, but I think the cumulative affect of playing big payroll teams may wear down the O's over 162, so they perform worse against teams outside of the division.

And as stated here before, FA pitchers really don't want to play in Baltimore and face those line ups all the time.

And third, it just doesn't make sense for teams to compete for the same playoff slot, but play vastly different levels of competition. 

Playing big payroll teams?  What about playing small payroll teams like Tampa who also beat our brains in?

I don't know if FA pitchers really don't want to play in Baltimore because it's my personal belief that the Orioles haven't tried.  I don't think the Orioles have made giant efforts to sign any quality free agents in the past few years.  Now if there were constant reports out there saying that the Orioles had equal offers on the table to other clubs and the player decided to go elsewhere, fine. 

It is easy to say that FA pitchers don't want to come play here because we haven't signed any.  But I don't think that statement can be true unless we know for a fact that quality free agents have turned the Orioles down time and time again.  

In regards to vastly different levels of competition, I'm not sure what the fix is there.  For argument sake, say there were no divisions, just the two separate leagues.  Each team played each other an equal amount of times throughout the season.  In that case, would we think the Yankees, Sox and Rays would somehow be mitigated due to a balanced, equal schedule?  Instead of beating up on us, they'd get to beat up on us, the Rangers and the Tigers and equal amount.  The Yankees, Sox and Rays are always going to be there in the end, no matter how you cut it.

If the desire to change up division alignment in order to avoid the Yankees, Sox and Rays as much as possible is what we're after here, then I guess we should be satisfied with playing weaker competition throughout the season, hoping to make the playoffs and hoping for "anything to happen" in a series with one of those teams.  

For me, that's not really ideal.  I'd like for Elias to build this organization in order to compete with the Yankees and Sox and Rays.  We can whine about payroll but we all know that payroll doesn't automatically create a great team.  I'd rather stick it out in this division against these teams so we know we can hang with them rather than be the best of an average group and lying to ourselves into thinking we're good.  

  • Upvote 3
Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Tony-OH said:

Well this is off the subject of this thread anyways.

On the subject, I think unbalanced schedules are distinct disadvantage and I don't know of too many fans that enjoy it. However, I think teams enjoy price gouging fans for games against big market teams with fans not too far to travel so in this case, I don't see the owners giving this up and I don't see the players caring one way o the other.

It's the fans that get left out in the cold.

The sad thing is, you could post this for SOO many varied subjects. Same meaning.

Quote

[Paragraph of words...]

 

It's the fans that get left out in the cold.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

Playing big payroll teams?  What about playing small payroll teams like Tampa who also beat our brains in?

I don't know if FA pitchers really don't want to play in Baltimore because it's my personal belief that the Orioles haven't tried.  I don't think the Orioles have made giant efforts to sign any quality free agents in the past few years.  Now if there were constant reports out there saying that the Orioles had equal offers on the table to other clubs and the player decided to go elsewhere, fine. 

It is easy to say that FA pitchers don't want to come play here because we haven't signed any.  But I don't think that statement can be true unless we know for a fact that quality free agents have turned the Orioles down time and time again.  

Well said.  The last time I remember the O’s chasing a top end free agent pitcher (if you even want to call him that) was Carl Pavano in the 2004-05 offseason.   He was the top FA pitcher that year (or close), but not someone who would have been top of the market in any other year.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

Well said.  The last time I remember the O’s chasing a top end free agent pitcher (if you even want to call him that) was Carl Pavano in the 2004-05 offseason.   He was the top FA pitcher that year (or close), but not someone who would have been top of the market in any other year.  

Carl Pavano, top end pitcher?  Sheesh, that must have been a rough offseason.  

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

13 hours ago, Frobby said:

He was considered the no. 2 guy on the market, behind Pedro Marinez and ahead of Kevin Millwood and Jaret Wright.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/vault.si.com/.amp/vault/2004/11/22/baseball-freeagent-watch

Pedro is fun to think about, always.  Could go without hearing the other names again for the rest of my life and would be perfectly happy to do so.  

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 10/27/2021 at 9:12 PM, owknows said:

MLB Locks out players.

Owners field teams of replacement players one month in, reaching into AA and AAA.

O's win the World Series.

 

All the minor league players are soon-to-be union members, almost all believing that they will shortly be benefiting from the MLBPA.  The experience of 1994-95 was that very, very few of them would cross the picket lines.  The strikebreakers from that era were indy leaguers and nondrafted players.  Way, way, way down in the player pool.  That's the main reason they never went ahead with regular season replacement player games, it was basically rookie league ball masquerading as the Majors.  This isn't the NFL, where players 90% as good as the regulars get released at the end of training camp and are free to be strike breakers.

I guess it would be cool if the "Orioles" won the World Series with a team 75% as good as the York Revolution.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.




  • Posts

    • Thanks for the detailed explanation of all of the issues.  Sounds like a mess.
    • Yeah the amenities are pretty outdated at the yard and they seem to do nothing year over year to improve them. The touchscreens have been banged on to death to the point they barely function, so you can't accurately fill out your order at the kiosks, and they don't have a way for the people behind the counter to ring you up at many of the food places. The sound is low to non-existent in certain sections of the club level, like around 218. Seems like there should be speakers that reach there but they might have been damaged by rain, etc. and they are too lazy to fix them. If you go to a game that's even slightly busy, you will wait forever to get into the bathroom, and the sink will be an absolute mess with no soap or paper towels. It's even worse on the club level where they have one sink that's right by the door. Nearby businesses don't care, either. The Hilton parking garage reeks of decay, pot and human waste. They don't turn on the air circulation fans, even if cars are waiting for an hour and a half to exit from P3, filling up the air with carbon monoxide. They only let you enter the stadium with one 20 oz bottle of water. It's so expensive to buy a drink or water in the stadium, but with all the salty food, 20 oz of water isn't enough, especially on a hot day. Vegetarian food options are poor to none, other than things like chips, fries, hot pretzels and the occasional pizza. Vida Taco is better, but at an inconvenient location for many seats. The doors on the club level are not accessible. They're anti-accessible. Big, heavy doors you have to go through to get to/from the escalators, and big, heavy doors to get to your seats, none of them automatic (or even with the option to be automatic with a button press). Makes it hard to carry food out to your seats even if not handicapped. The furniture in the lounges on the club level seem designed to allow as few people as possible to sit down. Not great when we have so many rain delays during the season. Should put more, smaller chairs in and allow more of the club level ticket holders to have a seat while waiting for thunderstorms to pass. They keep a lot of the entrance/exit gates closed except for playoff/sellout games, which means people have to slowly "mooooo" all the way down Eutaw St to get to parking. They are too cheap to staff all the gates, so they make people exit by the warehouse, even though it would be a lot more convenient for many fans to open all the gates. Taking Light Rail would be super convenient, except that if there's at least 20k fans in attendance, it's common to have to wait 90-120 minutes to be able to board a non-full train heading toward Glen Burnie. A few trains might come by, but they are already full, or fill up fast when folks walk up to the Convention Center stop to pre-empt the folks trying to board at Camden Station. None of the garages in the area are set up to require pre-payment on entry (reservation, or give them your card / digital payment at the entrance till). If they were, emptying out the garage would be very quick, as they wouldn't need to ticket anyone on the way out: if you can't get in without paying, you can always just leave without having to stop and scan your phone or put a ticket in the machine. They shut down the Sports Legends Museum at Camden Station in 2015 because the Maryland Stadium Authority was too greedy. That place was a fun distraction if you were in the area when a game wasn't about to start, like if you show up super early on Opening Day or a playoff day. Superbook's restaurant on Eutaw is a huge downgrade from Dempsey's in terms of menu and service quality. Dempsey's used to be well-staffed, you could reserve a table online, and they had all kinds of great selection for every diet. Superbook seems like just another bar serving the same swill that the rest of the park serves, with extremely minimal and low-quality food. For that matter, most of the food at the stadium is very low quality these days. A lot of things we used to love are made to a lower standard now if they are served at all. These are gripes about the stadium and the area that haven't changed my entire adult life. Going to an O's game requires one to tolerate many small inconveniences and several major inconveniences, any number of which could easily be fixed by the relevant authorities if they gave a damn about the people who pay to come see the team play. You would think a mid-market team would be able to afford to invest in the fan experience. You would think the city and partnering organizations like garages, the Stadium Authority and MTA would at least try to do their part to make the experience enjoyable and free of kinks. You would think they would put some thought into handling the "growing pains" of the fanbase due to recent renewed interest after the dark years. Instead, all we get is the same indifference and the same annoyances year in and year out. The whole area is overdue for a revamp. Not sure if $600 mil will get it done, but at least it's a start. Hopefully they can start to patch up some of the many holes in the fan experience. If you're not going to invest in Burnes, at least make it so paying customers have an easier, more enjoyable time getting to/from the stadium and having some food while we're there.
    • Elias has only been in rebuild mode with the O's so there's not much to speculate on there.  Houston, where he spent his formative years, doesn't seem to like to be on the hook for more than a couple of big long-term contracts at any given time.  I can see that as being Elias' choice as well, albeit with a lower overall cost - Houston runs a big payroll.  But it's all guesswork.  I really don't know. If Elias takes the 2025 payroll to $150 million it will creep up to $200 million or so by 2028 just from keeping the core together.  That's where I start to wonder about sustainability due to market size, economic forces, etc., etc., etc... If it were up to me, I would add a couple of free agents this offseason even if the contracts were longer than ideal and be conservative about extensions elsewhere until the prospects establish themselves a little better.  I think there's a competitive opportunity that the team is already into that's worth exploiting. I think ownership is very happy to have Elias on board and they're not inclined to force him to do anything.  I also think Rubenstein's demonstrated business prowess is great enough to assume that he has had plenty enough time to come to a mutual understanding with Elias as to goals.
    • We need a RH O’hearn…in addition to Westburg. At least 3 batters that will push up the pitch count and cause damage in the top 5 of the lineup.
    • Boy,  that Jackson Merrill is a good young player that is playing his best ball down the season stretch and in the playoffs.   He's only 21.  I guess some young guys are able to play up to the pressure.   Who could have guessed that?
    • I’m aware.   You are arguing something im Not.
    • What agreement? The agreement you are talking about happened as a result of the move.  The MASN agreement would not have existed if Angelos had gone to court to block the move.
  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...