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Pablo Lopez

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Sports Guy
Sports Guy

Mullins and Santander for Lopez, Meyer and Brian Anderson.

UMDTerrapins
UMDTerrapins

FWIW, I've seen a number of stories in the news that Miami is open to trading from the SP depth. 

Sports Guy
Sports Guy

I would much rather deal Mullins vs Cowser. Even if you are believer in Mullins right now, how much of a believer are you in him being an above average CFer defensively and giving you a 4+ WAR in

LookinUp Hangout Grand Counsel

LookinUp

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Definitely should try to add young pitching wherever they can, but I'll say the crazy thing. I think they should also be targeting a top vet or vets. You can't build a full staff/team on young alone. I think experience really matters.

If I were owner with a lot of $, I'd personally go after Grienke and/or Scherzer. Yeah, I know, that's definitely not happening, but it's what I'd do.

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interloper Hangout Grand Counsel

interloper

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I think we should probably be prepared that no one of note is traded off the roster this off-season. Elias has played it safe with trades so far (obvious reliever trades, obvious veteran trades). Will he trade one of his good, young players like Mullins or Means? I'm not sure yet. And does anyone want Santander or Mancini? I'm not sure about that either.

It all adds up to a feeling of doubt regarding any notable trades happening. Maybe Sulser, but even with that they could wait until the deadline. 

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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55 minutes ago, LookinUp said:

I feel like we'd have to add to that trade and probably significantly. Santander just isn't that valuable. I'd do it in a heartbeat though.

Well, you can also say that Anderson is only so valuable too.  I think Santander for Anderson, especially with Santander being cheaper and having an extra year of service time, is a fair offer.
 

 Whether we have to add to it largely depends on what value they place on Mullins.

If they value him as a 4+ WAR guy with several years of service time at a prime position, Lopez and Meyer is a fair offer.

If they value him as a 2-3 WAR guy than I agree we would need to add to it.  
 

I will say this though…I would rather trade Mullins in a deal to obtain pitching like this than trade say, DL Hall and other prospects for Lopez.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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39 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Who said Lopez is available? Why would Ng trade a solid #2/#3 SP under team control? 

Did you read the tweet in the OP?

Lots of talk of the Marlins using some of their pitching depth, which they do have, to acquire some positional talent.  
 

This is what the Os have been building  to do, so they should be all over this.

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LookinUp Hangout Grand Counsel

LookinUp

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8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Whether we have to add to it largely depends on what value they place on Mullins.

If they value him as a 4+ WAR guy with several years of service time at a prime position, Lopez and Meyer is a fair offer.

If they value him as a 2-3 WAR guy than I agree we would need to add to it.  

Yeah, I just don't think he'll be valued as a 4+ WAR player, last year notwithstanding. Still, you go get really good arms when you can. We have a lot of guys that we could put in a deal for two arms like this. I'd happily start with Mullins and consider adding from there.

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Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

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16 minutes ago, LookinUp said:

Yeah, I just don't think he'll be valued as a 4+ WAR player, last year notwithstanding. Still, you go get really good arms when you can. We have a lot of guys that we could put in a deal for two arms like this. I'd happily start with Mullins and consider adding from there.

That’s obviously where things will be at.  We just don’t know where they value him.  Still, I don’t think you would need to “significantly add” to this deal unless your definition of significantly is different than mine.

 

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Aristotelian Hangout Grand Counsel

Aristotelian

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1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

Did you read the tweet in the OP?

Lots of talk of the Marlins using some of their pitching depth, which they do have, to acquire some positional talent.  
 

This is what the Os have been building  to do, so they should be all over this.

Tweet says Blue Jays checking. Didn't say anything about Marlins offering. I would be really surprised to see them trade Lopez.

If he's available I'd be interested. I could see offering Hays and see what they say. Lopez may have a slightly higher WAR ceiling (2.7 WAR in only 100 innings) but Hays has an extra year of control. Would be trading from strength to strength.

Similar to the Luis Castillo idea someone proposed, I would not want to trade a high level prospect for three years of Lopez when the first year is likely to be noncompetitive but if they were interested in making a lateral trade OF for pitching I could see that being a win for both teams. They could have Mancini as well.

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HowAboutThat Hangout Grand Counsel

HowAboutThat

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It’s a no-brainer to remind everybody that any interested team will say “he’s just a regular guy,”and the Orioles will say “he’s the second coming.”

On the one hand, he did come out of nowhere, but on the other hand it’s possible to attribute that to giving up switchhitting, and point to the fact that he did it all season he was very consistent with both bat and glove. Who is the best salesman?

The most interesting subplot will be how the other GM’s deal with the first woman GM, and how she will deal with them. I don’t know if the Marlins are big trades yet, so that remains to be seen.

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HowAboutThat Hangout Grand Counsel

HowAboutThat

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3 hours ago, LookinUp said:

Definitely should try to add young pitching wherever they can, but I'll say the crazy thing. I think they should also be targeting a top vet or vets. You can't build a full staff/team on young alone. I think experience really matters.

If I were owner with a lot of $, I'd personally go after Grienke and/or Scherzer. Yeah, I know, that's definitely not happening, but it's what I'd do.

Why? Why can’t you build a staff on “Young“ alone? The old guys have lots of money and lots of experience, is that worth overpaying for their past and blocking one of the young guys? What benefit does that experience offer? They aren’t going to be coaching, the real coaches might be a bit miffed at that, and I’m not sure they offer anything worth their cost.

I’m not necessarily saying you’re wrong, but the qualities you’re describing are very tenuous and ethereal, I’m not sure they are worth pursuing. 

At the moment, we have a whole lot of flotsam and jetsam, and no guarantee that any of it will turn into something worth keeping, but at the same time we have to give all of it a chance to audition. Bringing an aged veteran on board is not productive.

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LookinUp Hangout Grand Counsel

LookinUp

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1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

That’s obviously where things will be at.  We just don’t know where they value him.  Still, I don’t think you would need to “significantly add” to this deal unless your definition of significantly is different than mine.

 

Mullins, Santander + 2 guys in our 10-25 range for both of those SP.

So Mullins, Santander, Vavra, Willems, for example. 

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