Orioles sign Chris Owings

[Il BuonO]

3 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

I'm not being positive.

I also don't think he's going to spend or promote aggressively in an attempt to win. 

Adley, Grayson and to a lesser extent Hall are in a position where you can't just leave them in the minors.  Elias is being forced to put out a at least somewhat competitive team this year.

Never admit to that! You’d shatter our perceptions.

As much as I would like to see them spend, I still wonder if he has free reign. I have my doubts. If it becomes apparent he doesn’t, then what’s changed. 

I’m sure everyone will readily accept the idea that the prospects along with depth signings will bring Baltimore a championship.

[Tony-OH]

1 hour ago, Il BuonO said:

First of all, to answer your question, a pitcher. 

Secondly, why isn’t Correa a realistic option? If you see them competing this year, doesn’t he help them do that? And then he’s with the crop they have coming up. Not only that, he becomes an immediate clubhouse presence with a history of winning. 

As far as the guys you have coming up, it doesn’t sound like you are even sure who would take over at SS. So, Correa starts there until one of the kids are ready and then they slide him over to 3B. 

Bottom line, Correa provides leadership and instant offense and defense. 

A transition year doesn’t limit them to just contending. Correa is realistic for any team who wants to compete and legitimizes a team to win down the road.

I'm not really sure how many times I have to say this, but I don't see them competing this year. I see them trying to win. 

As for a pitcher, who? Who you wanna give a huge contract to?

So you entire argument is that Correa makes the team better? Sure, he does that. I just don't see the Orioles outspending a large market team, including the Astros for his services. 

I've said many times that Correa makes some sense if the Orioles don't really think they have an house option, but I don't think they are ready to say that. 

[connja]

Correa may make the team better this year, when hey won't win more than 80 games even with him.  But the question is does it make them better long term to spend that money on SS when they could potentially (2-3 good options) could have similar quality output for the league minimum and spend those same resources somewhere else down the road.

Wouldn't we all rather have Henderson or Westburg or Ortiz producing similar WAR a couple years from now, with $35mm annually in the packet pocket to spend somewhere else?

Of course it's no sure thing that anyone comes close to Correa output, but those are your best prospects so that's what you bet on.

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, connja said:

Correa may make the team better this year, when hey won't win more than 80 games even with him.  But the question is does it make them better long term to spend that money on SS when they could potentially (2-3 good options) could have similar quality output for the league minimum and spend those same resources somewhere else down the road.

Wouldn't we all rather have Henderson or Westburg or Ortiz producing similar WAR a couple years from now, with $35mm annually in the packet pocket to spend somewhere else?

Of course it's no sure thing that anyone comes close to Correa output, but those are your best prospects so that's what you bet on.

Yes I think we would rather one of those players perform at the level Correa performs at.

I'm not sure how likely that is.

 

[connja]

20 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Yes I think we would rather one of those players perform at the level Correa performs at.

I'm not sure how likely that is.

 

I said similar - so even 75% of the WAR + 35mm.

[Il BuonO]

15 hours ago, Aglets said:

Yep still ok with the plan that Elias put into place and has been clear and straight forward with the fanbase about since Day 1.

I will say that one year from now I expect him to start putting the pedal to the metal.   Feel free to hold me to that.   Just as I continue to question why you get so frustrated when Elias is doing exactly what he said he would do.

Has he though? He said they were rebuilding without saying the words. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve been in favor of the hiring of Elias and I still think he’s the right guy, but at what point do people question the process? 

You expect him to put the pedal to the metal a year from now because he was clear and straightforward that year five was when it would all come together? Yeah, no.

In the end, Elias is only as good as ownership allows him to be. 

[Sports Guy]

7 hours ago, connja said:

I said similar - so even 75% of the WAR + 35mm.

We don’t even know if any of those players can stay at SS and/or hit enough to be an everyday MLer.

Correa can be on this team and you still have room to start Henderson, Mayo and Westburg.  
 

The player who gets squeezed is Ortiz but so what.  We have zero idea if he can hit or stay healthy enough for his defense to matter.  On top of that, prospects are there to be traded just as much as they are there to help in Baltimore.

While we sit around and wait on Ortiz, it’s far more likely he’s Manny Alexander or Ed Rogers than a 2.5-4 WAR SS.

[Sports Guy]

4 hours ago, Il BuonO said:

Has he though? He said they were rebuilding without saying the words. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve been in favor of the hiring of Elias and I still think he’s the right guy, but at what point do people question the process? 

You expect him to put the pedal to the metal a year from now because he was clear and straightforward that year five was when it would all come together? Yeah, no.

In the end, Elias is only as good as ownership allows him to be. 

The process won’t get questioned until it fails.

And ironically, even if it works, the Os will not have long term because they sucked short term.

That is what is really funny about all of this.  People genuinely believe that it’s imperative to be awful and lose on purpose for several years to build a team.  
 

It has nothing to do with it. 

[Aglets]

5 hours ago, Il BuonO said:

Has he though? He said they were rebuilding without saying the words. Don’t get me wrong, I’ve been in favor of the hiring of Elias and I still think he’s the right guy, but at what point do people question the process? 

You expect him to put the pedal to the metal a year from now because he was clear and straightforward that year five was when it would all come together? Yeah, no.

In the end, Elias is only as good as ownership allows him to be. 

Yes.  Those are my expectations.  You can say "yeah, no" but I actually consider myself to be one of the world's foremost experts on what my own expectations are.  

No he never promised 2023 as the year it all comes together.  He is far too clever/careful as a public speaker.  But using my powers of reason and deduction and looking at where all our top prospects currently are........that is what I figure makes the most sense.  I have been consistent on this since the lost COVID year.    He HAS made vague comments starting last year that the competitive window might not be too far away....i think i started a whole thread about it in '21.   And I don't think he ever spoke like that in 18-20.   Again, hold me to it. 

And yes he has been consistent when communicating with the fanbase about what his plan is for building a talent pipeline and investing in the minors / international market etc and getting that infrastructure in place before spending a lot of money on the MLB product.  He has never wavered from that.   And he says they will spend when the time is right.  One of the cool things about not lying to your fanbase during the down years is it builds up trust with the other things that you say about the future.    Criticize away if you want to.   But I look forward to the NEXT few years when the biggest arguments will be "Wow, we have a good team and it's fun to be in the playoff hunt but did Elias HAVE to do it this way?"    (I'll give you a spoiler - my answer will be the same as what I said to Rob earlier.   "Need" and "have to" have nothing to do with it).

[Frobby]

9 hours ago, connja said:

I said similar - so even 75% of the WAR + 35mm.

Pretty unlikely any of the guys we’re discussing will produce 75% of the WAR Correa does.   

[NelsonCruuuuuz]

I think this guy is the starting SS. Not joking. Pure SS it seems, which we lack other than Martin. 

[Frobby]

https://www.masnsports.com/school-of-roch/2022/03/owings-ready-to-own-shortstop-job-or-valuable-utility-role.html

[wildcard]

13 hours ago, NelsonCruuuuuz said:

I think this guy is the starting SS. Not joking. Pure SS it seems, which we lack other than Martin. 

Owings has not played 50 games at SS since 2017.   Looks more like a utility player at this point.  

[Frobby]

1 minute ago, wildcard said:

Owings has not played 50 games at SS since 2017.   Looks more like a utility player at this point.  

I agree.   But, I expect they’ll give him a shot to compete for the starting job.  

[wildcard]

11 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I agree.   But, I expect they’ll give him a shot to compete for the starting job.  

Sure but Mateo and Urias may out hit him and play SS just as well.  His versatility is his most attractive trait.