Returning Starting Pitchers.

[Sports Guy]

30 minutes ago, terpoh said:

Makes sense, but his trade value is probably far less than it was and what we may think it is. I think he is probably more valuable to the Orioles as a player vs as a trade piece now vs before because his value drop, but we will obviously need to make a move to a pitcher who moves the needle and he is one of our few remaining top 100 pieces to get that done. If this were to happen does this mean you are now in favor or re-signing Santander, or where does that lead your 2025 outfield?

I would assume Mountcastle and Mullins will be shopped hard this offseason for pitching as well.   

 

I don’t see any reason to think his trade value has dropped.  He’s a very valuable commodity 

[Sports Guy]

26 minutes ago, Sanfran327 said:

Who would you rather have as your lefty DH for 2025 and beyond: Kjerstad or O'Hearn?

You definitely prioritize the rotation over the LDH hitter, but I would be disappointed to trade Kjerstad for a 4th or 5th rotation arm. 

Well I don’t think you trade Kjerstad for that.

And while I would rather have Kjerstad and I don’t really want to trade him, he makes the most sense to trade and you need an impact player in a deal to get an impact pitcher back and he is the most logical guy in the org to do that.

[terpoh]

2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I don’t see any reason to think his trade value has dropped.  He’s a very valuable commodity 

He's going to be 26 years old next year. While he has shown flashes, he also hasnt really established himself in the big leagues either. You dont think thats less valuable than being a few years younger? Not saying his value is Stowers level, but I would think given those two things teams would rather have a much younger guy or a guy his age that is an established big leaguer.

[Sanfran327]

8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Well I don’t think you trade Kjerstad for that.

And while I would rather have Kjerstad and I don’t really want to trade him, he makes the most sense to trade and you need an impact player in a deal to get an impact pitcher back and he is the most logical guy in the org to do that.

With everyone we just traded, who to you package with Kjerstad to land what caliber of pitcher? Curious who you'd target and what you'd give up.

[sportsfan8703]

1 minute ago, terpoh said:

He's going to be 26 years old next year. While he has shown flashes, he also hasnt really established himself in the big leagues either. You dont think thats less valuable than being a few years younger? Not saying his value is Stowers level, but I would think given those two things teams would rather have a much younger guy or a guy his age that is an established big leaguer.

I’d prefer we let Santa, and Kimbrel walk, and then pay Burnes. Burnes at the top of this rotation for a 7 year run is ideal with our bats. If not, how many bats do we have to trade over those 7 years to replace him. 

Signing Burnes is paramount. If we get him, we can let Elias build back the farm system behind him to sustain our run and extend it. 

[wildcard]

1 hour ago, terpoh said:

Makes sense, but his trade value is probably far less than it was and what we may think it is. I think he is probably more valuable to the Orioles as a player vs as a trade piece now vs before because his value drop, but we will obviously need to make a move to a pitcher who moves the needle and he is one of our few remaining top 100 pieces to get that done. If this were to happen does this mean you are now in favor or re-signing Santander, or where does that lead your 2025 outfield?

I would assume Mountcastle and Mullins will be shopped hard this offseason for pitching as well.   

 

I agree the Mountcastle and Mullins could be used to trade for a pitcher.   When Westburg comes back he is the 3B.   That puts Mayo, Mountcastle and O'Hearn at  1B/DH.   And Mayo is a budding star that Elias has for 6 years.    So Mounty or O'Hearn get moved.

Cowser can play CF.   That makes Mullins more likely to be trading before his walk year.

Edited August 6 by wildcard

[terpoh]

Just now, sportsfan8703 said:

I’d prefer we let Santa, and Kimbrel walk, and then pay Burnes. Burnes at the top of this rotation for a 7 year run is ideal with our bats. If not, how many bats do we have to trade over those 7 years to replace him. 

Signing Burnes is paramount. If we get him, we can let Elias build back the farm system behind him to sustain our run and extend it. 

I think we definitely need to add to the projected 2025 rotation. Burnes is certainly an option if we're willing to live with the final 3-4 years of a very expensive 7 year contract

[Sports Guy]

6 minutes ago, terpoh said:

He's going to be 26 years old next year. While he has shown flashes, he also hasnt really established himself in the big leagues either. You dont think thats less valuable than being a few years younger? Not saying his value is Stowers level, but I would think given those two things teams would rather have a much younger guy or a guy his age that is an established big leaguer.

He hasn’t established himself because he’s blocked, not because he’s not good.

Ortiz was 26 too.

No, I don’t see any reason why Kjerstad has lost value.  In fact, he hit well in a SSS this year, so teams have seen him produce at this level.

[terpoh]

1 minute ago, wildcard said:

I agree the Mountcastle and Mullins could be used Ito trade for a pitcher.   When Westburg comes back he is the 3B.   That puts Mayo, Mountcastle and O'Hearn at  1B/DH.   And Mayo is a budding star that Elias has for 6 years.    So Mounty or O'Hearn get moved.

Cowser can play CF.   That makes Mullins more likely to be trading before his walk year.

Moving Mounty and/or Mullins make a lot of sense- For what they can bring back and also for our roster construction moving forward. I dont think Mullins will have a ton of value as a one year guy who has been on the decline. Mountcastle should have some solid value for a team looking for 1B and offense as a guy who can definitely start in this league for the next 2 years. If Mayo proves he can hit at this level over the next 2 months Mountcastle becomes increasingly expendable for 2025.

[Sports Guy]

7 minutes ago, Sanfran327 said:

With everyone we just traded, who to you package with Kjerstad to land what caliber of pitcher? Curious who you'd target and what you'd give up.

I mean, there are tons of answers to these questions. You could go so many different directions. Maybe he leads a package for Crochet. Maybe you try more of a 1 for 1 with him and a guy like Woo.  Maybe you go to Cinci or Pitt, 2 teams who need offense and have “extra” pitching.  Maybe the Giants?

It just depends on the player you get. The Os have plenty of guys they can pair with him if needs be. That’s not something I’m worried about.

Edited August 6 by Sports Guy

[Sanfran327]

Put me in the camp that thinks there's a shot to keep Burnes moving forward, or at least a smart reason to try our best. Maybe Rubenstein and Elias don't think it's quite time yet to spend that kind of money on an SP, but this specific circumstance is what it is, and won't come around again soon. 

We've had the chance to look at Burnes up close and personal all year. We know what he's made of and what his physical status is. If there was ever a guy to sink a quarter of a billion into, it's him. He's no regular free agent. We know him better than we'd know any other external FA. To me, this is the guy you try to keep if you believe he's 100% healthy, which we have no reason to doubt. 

[terpoh]

2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

He hasn’t established himself because he’s blocked, not because he’s not good.

Ortiz was 26 too.

No, I don’t see any reason why Kjerstad has lost value.  In fact, he hit well in a SSS this year, so teams have seen him produce at this level.

Yes, Ortiz was 26 and probably had lost trade value as well. You have been very adamant in not resigning Santander so I would think that makes keeping Kjerstad a must for the 2025 OF. Who would you play in the outfield next year if Kjerstad is gone?

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, terpoh said:

Yes, Ortiz was 26 and probably had lost trade value as well. You have been very adamant in not resigning Santander so I would think that makes keeping Kjerstad a must for the 2025 OF. Who would you play in the outfield next year if Kjerstad is gone?

I’m completely against signing Santander..but my opinion doesn’t matter and I think the Os will want to keep him. 
 

So with Santander and OHearn(in all likelihood) back, Kjerstad just doesn’t have the at bats because I don’t see them putting him in LF.

[Bemorewins]

I agree with those who assert that we need another pitcher.

My preference would be someone to anchor the rotation at the top (like Burnes now) to slot everyone else properly. 

We have a options in terms of how that pitcher is retained/acquired:

1) Resign Burnes (you aren’t paying anyone else right now).

2) Resign Santander and then use Kjerstad plus to acquire a Burnes replacement.

3) Sign a guy in FA like Fried.

The good news is that we have options. But none will be cheap.

We are probably going to need to acquire another SP candidate for depth to add to the pile of Suarez/Povich/McDermott.

[NedFromYork]

British!  Yes, knew I forgot one.  Suarez could also br listed as deep depth.

Edited August 6 by NedFromYork