Boswell: Peter Angelos is worse than Dan Snyder

[Frobby]

The Los Angeles Dodgers of Angelos.

Or, just the Los Angelos Dodgers.

[ccbird]

It'll be interesting to see if Redskins fans we have here agree. As someone who isn't a Redskins fan I would agree that Angelos is worse..

[MrOrange82]

I think there's an important distinction to make here. I think virtually everyone agrees that Angelos is making a mint off of his MASN deal, and that those proceeds are not going towards improving the Orioles. Where many of us disagree with Trea is in his belief that Angelos will actually start using this money to sign big name free agents like Fielder. Like Boswell said, he's greedy. And he has a cash cow. People and companies who are making great sums of money on an investment don't act to lessen profitability. Particularly when they aren't the only investor and have established a terrific ROI. Thinking that Angelos is suddenly going to start spending big money on players is nutty. We'd all love to see the payroll increased. It's just not going to happen on any meaningful level.

The problem is that the way PA spends money doesn't make much sense to outsiders (myself included). I've brought it up, along with others, several times previously: PA's payrolls aren't bottom of the barrel. He actually spends a lot to field some pretty lousy teams. If he ratcheted up his spending and improved the product, one would have to think his revenue from all sources could increase dramatically. In a related vein, he's not a miser. He spends a great deal of money on public/private projects. And attempting to buy the Dodgers would be another head-scratcher. Why sink that much cash into another, potential revenue stream when you could shore up your preexisting sources of revenue?

Those are the questions, IMO.

[TXOriole]

Its PA or Sterling as the worst owner in pro sports.

Except Sterling has done things to improve his team this year. (Billups, Butler, Paul)

[Satyr3206]

And I thought I knew baseball history. Has anyone ever owned 2 ML Teams? Is it even allowed by MLB? Calling Drungo.

[Larry18]

Snyder is worse by far. Well maybe not a worse owner but a far worse human being and that has to count for something.

[BilboBaggins]

I think there's an important distinction to make here. I think virtually everyone agrees that Angelos is making a mint off of his MASN deal, and that those proceeds are not going towards improving the Orioles. Where many of us disagree with Trea is in his belief that Angelos will actually start using this money to sign big name free agents like Fielder. Like Boswell said, he's greedy. And he has a cash cow. People and companies who are making great sums of money on an investment don't act to lessen profitability. Particularly when they aren't the only investor and have established a terrific annual ROI. Thinking that Angelos is suddenly going to start spending big money on players is nutty. We'd all love to see the payroll increased. It's just not going to happen on any meaningful level.

Have you ever read the arguments about how we are a "small market" and can't "afford" spending money on players because it will cripple the franchise?

Yesterday I posted that one day, sometime in the future when Angelos is out of the picture, Baltimore fans are going to be further appalled by the utter foolishness and incompetency of the Angelos era. There's so much we don't know about the warehouse proceedings, but every now and then, someone says something in the press that lets us know that things just can't get better.

He has the money to buy the Dodgers but can't even get us a decent set of starting pitchers or a MOO bat?

Ugh.

[UMDTerrapins]

The problem is that the way PA spends money doesn't make much sense to outsiders (myself included). I've brought it up, along with others, several times previously: PA's payrolls aren't bottom of the barrel. He actually spends a lot to field some pretty lousy teams. If he ratcheted up his spending and improved the product, one would have to think his revenue from all sources could increase dramatically. In a related vein, he's not a miser. He spends a great deal of money on public/private projects. And attempting to buy the Dodgers would be another head-scratcher. Why sink that much cash into another, potential revenue stream when you could shore up your preexisting sources of revenue?

Those are the questions, IMO.

His average payroll over the past six seasons is apx. $76 million. If he goes the way of the Marlins in the past and put a AAAA team on the field, there would be people with pitchforks outside OPACY, because everyone knows he has a gorgeous stadium and a healthy television deal. What he spends on payroll is just enough to quiet people from calling him cheap, but not enough to compete. Enough to prevent outrage, but nowhere near enough considering his means. Bringing in a Sammy Sosa or Vladimir Guerrero on one year deals is about appearances more than it is competitiveness.

And if you're Angelos or one of his fellow investors, you can have a terrific investment like they do now. Or you can commit yourself to trying to compete with the AL East, which will kill you margins because you will have to dramatically increase your organizational operating costs (not just ML payroll) over a long term. And even then, you're simply putting yourself on a level playing field. That's no guarantee of success. Yes, a well run franchise can compete with less. But they're not. And it's not worth it to try....they have a great thing going.

I'll go out on a limb. I hate the MASN deal. I don't think we deserve it. I think MLB failed Baltimore by not creating an legal instrument that required a minimum percentage of MASN profits realized by Angelos and his partners to be spent above a minimum payroll floor. The deal invited manipulation for their personal financial gain, and that's what we have now.

[NewMarketSean]

There aren't many owners in pro sports that are worse than Angelos. In face there may not be any.

[MrOrange82]

His average payroll over the past six seasons is apx. $76 million. If he goes the way of the Marlins in the past and put a AAAA team on the field, there would be people with pitchforks outside OPACY, because everyone knows he has a gorgeous stadium and a healthy television deal. What he spends on payroll is just enough to quiet people from calling him cheap, but not enough to compete. Enough to prevent outrage, but nowhere near enough considering his means. Bringing in a Sammy Sosa or Vladimir Guerrero on one year deals is about appearances more than it is competitiveness.

And if you're Angelos or one of his fellow investors, you can have a terrific investment like they do now. Or you can commit yourself to trying to compete with the AL East, which will kill you margins because you will have to dramatically increase your organizational operating costs (not just ML payroll) over a long term. And even then, you're simply putting yourself on a level playing field. That's no guarantee of success. Yes, a well run franchise can compete with less. But they're not. And it's not worth it to try....they have a great thing going.

I'll go out on a limb. I hate the MASN deal. I don't think we deserve it. I think MLB failed Baltimore by not creating an legal instrument that required a minimum percentage of MASN profits realized by Angelos and his partners to be spent above a minimum payroll floor. The deal invited manipulation for their personal financial gain, and that's what we have now.

Unfortunately, though what you said sounds reasonable, your comments beg two questions: (1) if, as you say, PA is willing to spend just enough (a fairly substantial amount) to keep hordes of angry Baltimoreans off his doorstep, then why is he so unwilling to spend that same amount of money intelligently? There's no reason he can't win with a $76ish million payroll. (2) the preceding notwithstanding, if you honestly believe that his motivation IS to spend the bare minimum to keep fans at bay while turning a tidy profit, regardless of the win/loss consequences, then why harbor ANY hope whatsoever that the O's will make changes to become a winning team?

It seems as though the necessary consequences of your arguments are either that Angelos is incapable of spending middle-of-the-road money intelligently enough to win in the AL East (so why bother), or that Angelos doesn't actually care what happens in the standings, so he almost certainly won't make changes that'll make the O's a winning team (so why bother).

[weams]

From an online chat yesterday:

http://live.washingtonpost.com/ask-boswell-010312.html

Yep. It is such a shame.

[weams]

There aren't many owners in pro sports that are worse than Angelos. In face there may not be any.

Fred Wilpon, Frank McCourt, Jeffrey Loria

[bobmc]

And I thought I knew baseball history. Has anyone ever owned 2 ML Teams? Is it even allowed by MLB? Calling Drungo.

I am certain that PA had this altruistic idea to sell to Cal and then buy the Dodgers for he and his boyz. Makes cents.....

[weams]

And I thought I knew baseball history. Has anyone ever owned 2 ML Teams? Is it even allowed by MLB? Calling Drungo.

He would have had to sell the Orioles in order to make the deal. And no, you can't own two teams. It is a shame they did not go along with it.

[WVOriolesFan]

It'll be interesting to see if Redskins fans we have here agree. As someone who isn't a Redskins fan I would agree that Angelos is worse..

I am a huge Redskins fan and Angelos is far worse. Dan Snyder has made plenty of mistakes, but he wants to win plain and simple. He will always spend money and in his mind he is trying to win. He tries to do too much and needs to let his football guys make the decisions, which I think he is doing now with Bruce Allen but in the end he is trying to win.

Peter Angelos doesn't care about winning anymore and that is the big difference for me.