Do you think this is the year the Nats really start to infringe on the Orioles?

[Whammer]

Yeah, this is it for me as well.

Like Frobby, I tend to think the fanbase has pretty much sorted itself out by this point. If the Nats have a successful season and gain more fans, it will likely be casual fans who will be just as quick to turn away again if the team struggles. I don't ever see that city really fervently supporting the Nationals like they do the Redskins, but certainly a sustained run of success would help.

I'm a die-hard O's fan living in Mont. Cty. Although I work right next to a Metro Station, I have resisted the temptation to visit Nats Park for the last 3 years. Typically, when in the mood to drink a beer and watch live baseball, I trek up to OPACY. However, this year will probably be the year I check out the Nats. I can't help but to believe that the O's, as currently constructed, have 100-losses written all over them. Just don't think I can stomach another year of spending perfectly good $$$ watching dreadfully bad baseball.

Hope I'm wrong on all counts . . . .

[Hang10]

The Orioles have some substanital advantages. A sizeable and very loyal fan base, a long and storied history for much of the 58 year existance of the team albeit blemished by the most recent 14 years, one of the best stadiums in the country and one that is recognized as revolutionary in the game, a beautiful city with a long history of supporting and contributing in a significant way to baseball, a franchise that has produced some of the most important moments in the game, a stable presence that extends over a half a century, a professional executive team, and placement within the best division in all of baseball which providing instant credibility to any success the team has, even if it is small improvement.

The Nats on the other hand have a mininscule fan base, play in a region that has little interest in the team and actually is populated with more Oriole fans than Nats fans, a region that has never supported baseball and has lost two teams due to disinterest, a transient population which supports teams from the region from which they relocated be it the Phillies, Cubs, Cardinals, Braves or others, play in a stadium which is a cookie cutter replica of others and exists in a desolate area devoid of any improvements unlike Baltimore which is in a vibrant urban setting, a stadium greeted with disinterest nationally, a team which was never embraced by a community that is disinterested in it, an air of lack of professionalism which extends down to the broadcast crew, and presence in a mediocre and bland division which produces little interest nationally outside the recent surge of the Philadelphia franchise.

Having said all of that, if the Nats are competitive this year and the Orioles continue uncompetitive play, the Nats will indeed encroach on the Orioles fan base and will begin to solidify their own.

I don't anticipate this will happen however and the Orioles will continue to have much higher interest in the DC area and higher TV ratings in DC than the Nationals. I acknowledge I am an optimist however, and I remember the good times unlike many on this board.

[DrungoHazewood]

I think the Nats will be more popular this year, they'll play much better baseball than the O's. They'll certainly have more of a presence nationally. But I don't think it'll have much of any effect on the O's. The only fans the O's have are the die hards, they're not going anywhere. And the casual fans who go to a few games a year because they went to the movies last week and the Inner Harbor the week before and didn't want to do that again. Angelos gets his MASN money from coerced subscription fees that are uneffected by the O's record, and he'll get more advertising money if the Nats are good.

The O's have long since bottomed out, the Nats have no substantial effect on that. They're like the Pirates. Until they win 85 or 90 games one year, they'll just keep chugging along on guaranteed income sources. This is the flipside of Bud and the owners decoupling winning from making money - teams that can exist indefinitely without winning or losing enough money to incentivize winning.

[Enjoy Terror]

I wouldn't go see a Ryan Reynolds movie because I have male reproductive organs.

Buried was a nice flick he made. I dont think you need to be ashamed of him any more than you should be ashamed to see Ryan Gosling in anything (you shouldn't).

[Frobby]

The Orioles have some substanital advantages. A sizeable and very loyal fan base, a long and storied history for much of the 58 year existance of the team albeit blemished by the most recent 14 years, one of the best stadiums in the country and one that is recognized as revolutionary in the game, a beautiful city with a long history of supporting and contributing in a significant way to baseball, a franchise that has produced some of the most important moments in the game, a stable presence that extends over a half a century, a professional executive team, and placement within the best division in all of baseball which providing instant credibility to any success the team has, even if it is small improvement.

The Nats on the other hand have a mininscule fan base, play in a region that has little interest in the team and actually is populated with more Oriole fans than Nats fans, a region that has never supported baseball and has lost two teams due to disinterest, a transient population which supports teams from the region from which they relocated be it the Phillies, Cubs, Cardinals, Braves or others, play in a stadium which is a cookie cutter replica of others and exists in a desolate area devoid of any improvements unlike Baltimore which is in a vibrant urban setting, a stadium greeted with disinterest nationally, a team which was never embraced by a community that is disinterested in it, an air of lack of professionalism which extends down to the broadcast crew, and presence in a mediocre and bland division which produces little interest nationally outside the recent surge of the Philadelphia franchise.

Having said all of that, if the Nats are competitive this year and the Orioles continue uncompetitive play, the Nats will indeed encroach on the Orioles fan base and will begin to solidify their own.

I don't anticipate this will happen however and the Orioles will continue to have much higher interest in the DC area and higher TV ratings in DC than the Nationals. I acknowledge I am an optimist however, and I remember the good times unlike many on this board.

I must be missing the evidence that the Orioles have a "professional executive team" while the Nats have a "lack of professionalism." And contrary to what you seem to imply, the broadcasters have no role in running the team. The Nats' front office has done a superb job ever since Rizzo took over for Bowden. I'd love to have Rizzo as our GM, and the Lerners instead of Angelos.

The O's had a huge advantage in 2005 when the Nats arrived, and have frittered most of it away through ineptitude. Every year, the population of fans old enough to remember the "glory years" shrinks, and the group that has only known losing grows.

[NewMarketSean]

I just fail to see the built in animosity of the Nationals. I used to be a big anti-DC guy; hated all the teams, enjoyed their misery, etc...then I grew up and realized that it didn't make any sense. Their teams aren't that great and their fans don't really care. Even the Redskins which have a die-hard core of fans don't support them anymore -- similar to the Orioles.

If the Nats are good, great. I will probably check out a few games and maybe even go to some. So far I have been to exactly one -- an Orioles game in DC. Ronny Beliard hit the game winning HR off Sherrill. It was a miserable day.

Yeah sure, Baltimore has the better gameday experience and more to see and do close to the stadium. All that is great until you sit down to watch the team play. That is where the Nats have the advantage now. Their team is actually shaping up to be pretty good.

[Whammer]

The Nats on the other hand have a mininscule fan base, play in a region that has little interest in the team and actually is populated with more Oriole fans than Nats fans, a region that has never supported baseball and has lost two teams due to disinterest, a transient population which supports teams from the region from which they relocated be it the Phillies, Cubs, Cardinals, Braves or others, play in a stadium which is a cookie cutter replica of others and exists in a desolate area devoid of any improvements unlike Baltimore which is in a vibrant urban setting, a stadium greeted with disinterest nationally, a team which was never embraced by a community that is disinterested in it, an air of lack of professionalism which extends down to the broadcast crew, and presence in a mediocre and bland division which produces little interest nationally outside the recent surge of the Philadelphia franchise.

Dude: you do realize that the Nats outdrew the O's the last two years, right?

[BrunoCherrytown]

Buried was a nice flick he made. I dont think you need to be ashamed of him any more than you should be ashamed to see Ryan Gosling in anything (you shouldn't).

I think to your point it's much easier to defend Ryan Reynolds/Gosling movies over Dan Duquette's offseason. I find more "depth" in a Ryan Reynolds movie than the O's offseason moves. In fact, if the Orioles' offseason was a movie it would star Ryan Reynolds, Sandra Bullock, Matthew McConaughey, Kate Hudson, Ashton Kutcher and Keanu Reeves. That's my opinion of the dumpster diving offseason we've all just had the joy of living through.

[carolinaoriole]

No they will not. I only actually know 1 person that knows the Nationals even exsist. The only place I ever hear or read about the Nationals is the MASN website or here. I do not know how they could overtake any team.

They likely will finish no better than 3rd in their division and will have spent all that money for nothing.

[cb3fsu]

When both teams suck its easy to retain your traditional fanbase.

When one team continues its futility giving fans no reason to believe a turnaround is anywhere near the horizon and the other begins running their team well it becomes much harder to justify subjecting ones self to infinite misery.

If you are a Ravens fan do you not find yourself questioning how Skins fans don't just make the easy transition to rooting for an accessible team that is run as well as any other in the league?

The Orioles have 3-5 years before the Nats take over the young fanbase if they start winning. They have good young players, a great manager and don't seem to have any trouble pulling the trigger on expensive draft picks and free agents.

If you're 10 years old, which team do yu want to watch right now?

[DrungoHazewood]

No they will not. I only actually know 1 person that knows the Nationals even exsist. The only place I ever hear or read about the Nationals is the MASN website or here. I do not know how they could overtake any team.

They likely will finish no better than 3rd in their division and will have spent all that money for nothing.

Your comfortable world is about to be rudely intruded upon. The Nats draw more fans than the O's. They will win more than the O's in 2012, barring some miracle. They're renegotiating their MASN rights fees, giving them more money to spend. They're already on that path to sustaining winning and growth, leaps and bounds ahead of the Orioles. They're going to field a competitive team and be on TV against the Phils and the Braves and the new look Marlins all the time. The buzz around Strasburg and Harper will be very substantial.

It's very likely that by the end of 2012 the Nats will be one of the up and coming teams in baseball while the O's will continue to wallow with the Pirates. We can all hope Duquette starts to fix that, but the most likely outcome is ugly.

[Fan4Life]

Your comfortable world is about to be rudely intruded upon. The Nats draw more fans than the O's. They will win more than the O's in 2012, barring some miracle. They're renegotiating their MASN rights fees, giving them more money to spend. They're already on that path to sustaining winning and growth, leaps and bounds ahead of the Orioles. They're going to field a competitive team and be on TV against the Phils and the Braves and the new look Marlins all the time. The buzz around Strasburg and Harper will be very substantial.

It's very likely that by the end of 2012 the Nats will be one of the up and coming teams in baseball while the O's will continue to wallow with the Pirates. We can all hope Duquette starts to fix that, but the most likely outcome is ugly.

How much of their future potential (that over shadows the O's) would you attribute to our winning a few extra games near/at the end of the season given them a higher pick order?

[glenn__davis]

If you are a Ravens fan do you not find yourself questioning how Skins fans don't just make the easy transition to rooting for an accessible team that is run as well as any other in the league?

I am not a fan of either, but I don't question Skins fans at all. Or Ravens fans for that matter. This idea of switching teams because yours is not successful is just totally foreign to me. It is not an "easy transition" at all.

I don't know, I guess from a logical perspective I understand the points some of you are making, but from a fan's perspective it just makes no sense to me.

Different strokes for different folks. The O's could stink for another 15 years, and I'd still be a fan. Might not follow them as closely, but I still wouldn't root for another team. They could tell me my mother was a hamster and my father smelt of elderberries, but I'd still root for them over anyone else.

[mcgraw238]

I won't be watching the Nats anymore than I'll be watching the Phillies, Braves or Marlins. It sucks being an O's fan but I won't be allocating time to another franchise. I suppose th Nats location is what makes them a repeated topic of discussion on an O's message board (their not the only team with talent), however, I could care less whether they are located in Washington, DC or Portland, OR. The Nats are just another team to me. The constant lusting over the Nats borders on comical.

[DrungoHazewood]

How much of their future potential (that over shadows the O's) would you attribute to our winning a few extra games near/at the end of the season given them a higher pick order?

There is obviously a small advantage to picking #1 overall. In retrospect it's easy to say you'd want the O's to lose as much as possible, given that they've been terrible anyway. But in the times and places we were it's hard to tell a team we're going to tank the year for a draft pick when you've been trying to sell everyone on the fact we're trying to build something good here.

I think baseball would be better off with something like a draft lottery among the teams with losing records. As it stands it is a small incentive to lose more games.

In any case, the O's couldn't have done much worse than some of their Septembers of the last 15 years. You do remember Hargrove and the 4-32 finish, right?