National Media Read This!

[Lucky Jim]

How about we try this a different way, since apparently the discussion of Hunter / Arrieta / Matusz is far to confusing for many of you to understand.

The O's current starting rotation and top 5 bullpen arms have an ERA of 3.28 and a WHIP of 1.25. That's the actual performance of the actual pitchers the team is putting on the field right now. It's not smoke and mirrors, its not magic that's created by removing the worst three pitchers. It's actual statistics you can look up.

The team is winning primarily because the current staff is pitching very well. If you don't believe that, then I'm not sure that you are vulnerable to reason.

I'm going to take a break from my hiatus to shut this down.

Our record in August, with all new pitchers is 15-8. We've scored all of SIX runs more than the opposition.

[Loophole]

How about we try this a different way, since apparently the discussion of Hunter / Arrieta / Matusz is far to confusing for many of you to understand.

The O's current starting rotation and top 5 bullpen arms have an ERA of 3.28 and a WHIP of 1.25. That's the actual performance of the actual pitchers the team is putting on the field right now. It's not smoke and mirrors, its not magic that's created by removing the worst three pitchers. It's actual statistics you can look up.

The team is winning primarily because the current staff is pitching very well. If you don't believe that, then I'm not sure that you are vulnerable to reason.

...now do the same with all the other teams. Back up your stats. Make them mean something.

[orayole]

I think we all need to stop worrying about what others think or what stats say and just enjoy the wins.

[Loophole]

I think we all need to stop worrying about what others think or what stats say and just enjoy the wins.

I don't think anyone disagrees. I've pretty much resigned to the belief that this team is run by magic. Which is why these statistically-misleading defenses are just silly.

[Barnaby Graves]

I've pretty much resigned to the belief that this team is run by magic.

The keys to our win last night were home runs by Lew Ford and Nate McLouth. They should rename the stadium to Oriole Park at Hogwarts.

[SrMeowMeow]

How about we try this a different way, since apparently the discussion of Hunter / Arrieta / Matusz is far to confusing for many of you to understand.

The O's current starting rotation and top 5 bullpen arms have an ERA of 3.28 and a WHIP of 1.25. That's the actual performance of the actual pitchers the team is putting on the field right now. It's not smoke and mirrors, its not magic that's created by removing the worst three pitchers. It's actual statistics you can look up.

The team is winning primarily because the current staff is pitching very well. If you don't believe that, then I'm not sure that you are vulnerable to reason.

Nobody is confused by you, Mister Martyr. Your argument lacks any rigor and you're getting all weird and angry with zero provocation.

But at least your argument has its own Ben & Jerry's flavor.

[bluedog]

Essentially, yes -- because I'd bet that most other teams don't do much worse. Some teams have probably done better. It isn't an uncommon magical event when teams cycle through 5.00+ ERA pitchers until they find guys who won't be quite so crappy.

Instead of having this argument you could've just looked at the stats for other teams after they cut their bad pitchers. You realize the national media usually has higher standards than a single set of statistics in a one-team vacuum.

Yeah the national media is a bastion of complex analysis and insight. You've completely sold me.

Look you are either able to grasp this concept or not. The O's season long pitching stats don't effectively represent the quality and performance of the current staff. This is why people are confused about why the O's are doing so well.

The aggregate stats say the O's pitching is likely to give up 4+ runs a game and fail to get through 6 innings. The actual pitching performances we're seeing on a nightly basis are better than those stats suggest.

Can you really tell me that you can't see that?

[Barnaby Graves]

Look you are either able to grasp this concept or not. The O's season long pitching stats don't effectively represent the quality and performance of the current staff. This is why people are confused about why the O's are doing so well.

Our record in August, with all new pitchers is 15-8. We've scored all of SIX runs more than the opposition.

rutabaga

[bluedog]

Nobody is confused by you, Mister Martyr. Your argument lacks any rigor and you're getting all weird and angry with zero provocation.

But at least your argument has its own Ben & Jerry's flavor.

Angry? Apparently you now have a magic device that translates text into emotions! How special for you!

I will say, I've avoided calling other people names in this thread, which you've gotten to pretty quickly.

Just answer this one question for me. Will you please explain what is wrong with the statement that the current staff is not representative of the overall stats for the season.

Seriously - instead of calling me names and being demeaning (which you've proven you're a master at), try just ONCE to actually address what I'm saying.

[Orioles West]

This...

[El Gordo]

I've spent a couple of months now listening to the national press discussing the Orioles and why they are having so much success and it seems like the only reason that anyone can come up with is "they've been lucky in close games".

Apparently these people who are paid to do nothing but watch games and be "experts" on the subject can't be bothered to look any deeper than obvious stats that are spoon fed to them by ESPN or MLB.com.

So I think we should maintain a thread where we help them out by digging a little deeper into the O's success and spoon feed them some alternative explanations on why the O's are a legitimate playoff contender.

If you remove Hunter, Arrieta and Matusz from the O's stats for the season it looks like this:

Wins: 58

Losses: 30

IP: 848.67

Hits: 786

ER: 326

BB: 285

SO: 692

K/9: 7.34

WHIP: 1.26

ERA: 3.46

That would put the O's 2nd in ERA (tied with Oakland, behind Tampa) and 5th in WHIP.

In addition the O's staff sans Hunter / Arrieta / Matusz is 28 games above .500 and has 6 starters (Chen, Hammel, Gonzalez, Tillman, Britton and Johnson) with winning records and 5 starters with ERA's below 3.78.

Finally the O's have the top setup man in the AL (Strop) and the leader in saves (Johnson).

To put it in the simplest possible terms - outside of Hunter / Matusz / Arrieta, the O's have one of the best pitching staffs in the majors, and those three guys aren't a critical part of the O's current roster.

THAT's why they are playing so well.

Now you can make the argument that anyone can cherry pick their pitching rotations stats and remove the worst 3 pitchers and make their stats look much better, but the fact is the O's staff as it is currently constructed is the staff reflected by the stats above and not by the aggregate stats that media experts tend to use when trying to figure out why the O's are doing so well.

What is the RD in games not pitched by Matusz, Arrieta, and Hunter? They account for 54 GS.

[bluedog]

The keys to our win last night were home runs by Lew Ford and Nate McLouth. They should rename the stadium to Oriole Park at Hogwarts.

So Chen holding one of the best offenses in the majors to one unearned run played so small a part that it's not worth mentioning? I'll bear that in mind. Thanks.

[Loophole]

Yeah the national media is a bastion of complex analysis and insight. You've completely sold me.

Look you are either able to grasp this concept or not. The O's season long pitching stats don't effectively represent the quality and performance of the current staff. This is why people are confused about why the O's are doing so well.

The aggregate stats say the O's pitching is likely to give up 4+ runs a game and fail to get through 6 innings. The actual pitching performances we're seeing on a nightly basis are better than those stats suggest.

Can you really tell me that you can't see that?

This is entering vintage OldFan levels of intransigence. Everyone understands what you're saying. What you're saying could be understood by an infant. That's the problem.

[bluedog]

What is the RD in games not pitched by Matusz, Arrieta, and Hunter? They account for 54 GS.

Over the past 10 starts by Hunter alone, the RD was -35

[bluedog]

This is entering vintage OldFan levels of intransigence. Everyone understands what you're saying. What you're saying could be understood by an infant. That's the problem.

Really? I don't see anyone saying they understand or even are willing to consider the value of what I'm saying. I see a lot of people being very aggressive and rude.

I listened to four different people on ESPN today say that they don't understand why the O's are winning and that when they look at the stats, they see nothing that suggests the O's winning is sustainable.

None of them mentioned how well the O's current starters are pitching. They didn't even suggest it as a possibility. In fact each of them grabbed on to the record in one run games as the only possible explanation.

Watching Chen and now Tillman pitch brilliant games against the White Sox, it seems to me that its a crime that the media doesn't get that the O's pitching is doing great. Not sure why anyone would want to argue with that, but apparently you do.