Braun, Arod & others to be suspended...?

[Lester Freamon]

But in this instance they are talking about suspending folks that haven't failed a test. The only proof they have is that of Bosch, both his inaccurate document trail and his coerced assistance.

Obviously I have no idea what kind of proof MLB does or doesn't have from Bosch or other sources. However, the CBA does give MLB the ability to suspend players even if they have not failed a test. There are stipulations (not sure if that is the right word), drug related, that will allow them to suspend a player. I believe lying to MLB while they are conducting a drug investigation is one of them.

[Why Not?]

Obviously I have no idea what kind of proof MLB does or doesn't have from Bosch or other sources. However, the CBA does give MLB the ability to suspend players even if they have not failed a test. There are stipulations (not sure if that is the right word), drug related, that will allow them to suspend a player. I believe lying to MLB while they are conducting a drug investigation is one of them.

Jay Gibbons and Jose Guillen were both suspended for having purchased PEDs. Same with Jordan Shaffer, who was in the minors.

[SeaBird]

They still need proof. And as I said before,they need to start voiding contracts.

THat is the only way to put a stop to this.

You can say it as many times as you like but the bottom line is that there is no provision in the CBA or drug policy that allows for voiding contracts.

[SeaBird]

But in this instance they are talking about suspending folks that haven't failed a test. The only proof they have is that of Bosch, both his inaccurate document trail and his coerced assistance.

I'll bet they have a lot more evidence than lab notes and Bosch's recollections.

[SeaBird]

Obviously I have no idea what kind of proof MLB does or doesn't have from Bosch or other sources. However, the CBA does give MLB the ability to suspend players even if they have not failed a test. There are stipulations (not sure if that is the right word), drug related, that will allow them to suspend a player. I believe lying to MLB while they are conducting a drug investigation is one of them.

In addition to testing positive for a banned substance, a player can be suspended for purchasing, receiving, possessing, distributing or consuming banned substances.

[Gurgi]

I am very interested in how this story plays out and who gets nailed. As long as Machado isnt anywhere near this list I will be happy.

[Can_of_corn]

I'll bet they have a lot more evidence than lab notes and Bosch's recollections.

If they do then they do. They haven't bothered to leak that stuff yet and we know how much they love to leak.

Just read a deadspin piece.

Evidently Bosch tried to get money from Arod to help pay the MLB induced legal bills before giving in to MLB's economic pressure.

As for the more evidence...

The Daily News reported Wednesday that baseball was concerned Bosch might turn to players for financial help if MLB didn’t lock him into an agreement to testify.

“They were afraid someone else would pay him,” said the source. “Bosch is the only guy that can provide them with what they need.”

It also looks like MLB will intervene with law enforcement, just like they did with the Mitchell report.

http://deadspin.com/report-a-rod-refuses-to-give-bosch-money-bosch-cuts-d-511597230?utm_campaign=socialflow_deadspin_twitter&utm_source=deadspin_twitter&utm_medium=socialflow

[Migrant Redbird]

If they do then they do. They haven't bothered to leak that stuff yet and we know how much they love to leak.

No pre-existing bias there?

Individuals leak information, not organizations. If you can identify the individual who did the leak, that's one thing, but you shouldn't tar an entire organization over a past leak or leaks which may not have come from them at all.

.... Just read a deadspin piece.

One of the most biased, inaccurate, and poorly written articles I've ever read.

For example:

Among the benefits Bosch will reportedly get for his cooperation is Baseball's intervention in any potential legal actions from the various law enforcement organizations who might be interested in what he has to say when he sings about all the performance enhancing drugs he provided players.

The only "benefits" I'm aware of that Bosch is getting from MLB is the dropping of MLB's lawsuit against him (Bosch is broke, so MLB wasn't going to get anything from him anyhow) and prosecutors and judges taking into account his cooperation when they get around to trying and sentencing him for his crimes. We don't even know if MLB has agreed to influence the prosecutors and judges to mitigate any of the punishment Bosch may eventually get for his crimes.

So here's Major League Baseball?doggedly hunting down so-called cheats and players who have been demonized because of their association with a fountain-of-youth charlatan?bankrolling the guy even those same cheats won't help.

That's very biased language, "so-called", "demonized", "fountain-of-youth charlatan". The whole tone of that is to disparage MLB and to excuse the "demonized" players who were knowingly violating the law, MLB regulations, and their own CBA.

Newell also asserts that MLB is "bankrolling" Bosch. There's no evidence of that.

[xKHx]

What would they do in Melky's case? I heard he might get suspended but wasn't he already suspended last year? Why would he get hit twice one for failing the test the other for buying? I don't get it.

[El Gordo]

IMO this is more about PR than anything else. The nature of PED use has changed, but it is still prevalent though not as obvious. If The MLB wanted to catcch virtually all of the testosterone users, they need only send all of the test results to Montreal, regardless of the T/E ratio. But this would lead to two things Bud doesn't want. Much greater expense, and the revelation of 100's of players being caught. Very bad for the public perception of the MLB's drug testing efficacy. No, much better and cheaper to be seen doggedly pursuing the 20 or so cheaters who have somehow managed to slip through the cracks of their almost seamless testing program and make the players ASSC. look bad for defending those cheaters. Never mind if they can't really convince an arbitrator, with their evidence. Any way the outcome won't happen until the off season.

[crissfan172]

One of the most biased, inaccurate, and poorly written articles I've ever read.

That's pretty much all of Deadspin's garbage.

[CA-ORIOLE]

His wife gets fired if she flunks a drug test, even though she's a union member. A baseball player only gets suspended, loses pay for the period of the suspension, then goes back to work and continues to get a huge salary. You've got it backwards. Besides, most of these guys have already been paid enough to be set for life if they've invested it wisely. The ordinary Joe is not only out of a job and maybe broke with mortgage payments due; he's also going to have a difficult time finding another job. Quit crying about how tough these spoiled, overpaid athletes have it!

These players work under a Collective Bargaining agreement, negotiated between MLB and the players union. The CBA policy on drugs was well publicized and explained to them thoroughly before they voted on it. A majority of the players voted to accept the CBA.

Yes, the CBA is a lot tougher on drugs, primarily because union was afraid that Congress would intervene if they didn't go along with a tough drug policy. All these players knew that what they were doing violated federal and state laws, MLB regulations, and the CBA and that they faced harsh penalties if they got caught. They were gambling that they wouldn't get caught, and they lost. Many of them still were able to greatly enhance their income by cheating.

No one is going to get railroaded. Tony Bosch was coerced into cooperating with MLB because he couldn't afford the legal costs of defending himself from an MLB lawsuit, but that in and of itself doesn't discredit his testimony. His testimony is vital because his record keeping was deliberately sparse to camouflage his activities and the names of his clients, but it was sufficient for him to keep track of his clients and it will be sufficient to document the cases against his clients when supplemented with his testimony.

All of these clients knowingly violated the law, but few if any of them will face criminal charges because law enforcement authorities rarely prosecute the athletes who use performance enhancing drugs, except in the cases where they give perjured sworn testimony and interfere with investigations targeting the traffickers.

Ehh, the situations are quite different. A normal union employee wouldn't expect a de-facto police force questioning their friends and/or business associates regarding suspected drug usage. Not to mention paying people (involved in illegal activity themselves) for "evidence" as well as intimidating them with lawsuits using monetary leverage and intimidation tactics etc.

That said, I really don't have a problem with your post here. I fully understand that evidence doesn't need to be a positive drug test and MLB can conduct investigations etc. It's not that I feel sorry for them and/or think they are probably not guilty. Perhaps your point is correct that this is what they signed for with the CBA (though I believe that will be disputed) .... but It does give me some reason for pause.

[Odenton O]

While I do believe that there is a significant chance that the players in question are guilty I am still forced to root against MLB due to the nature in which they are operating.

Their "case" appears to depend upon the shoddy records kept by a disgraced Anthony Bosch. They obtained these records by the using the legal system as a bludgeon. It would not be a great leap to question those records.

MLB constantly lauds it's testing system, a number of these players did not fail tests.

To me, it is a pretty disgraceful show being put on by MLB.

How do you think real law enforcement puts away real criminals? Whether it's cops going after drug dealers or the FBI taking on the mob, it's the same approach: Get a good case against one guy, then lean on him until you get him to roll on the guys further up the chain. If the FBI gets one mob enforcer on murder charges, and gets him to testify against his bosses and get them sent away, do we complain that the government's case is based on a witness with questionable character? Or do we applaud law enforcement for putting away as many crooks as possible? It's the same basic approach that MLB is using. Now, I wouldn't give as much deference to MLB as I would to local or federal law enforcement in terms of their methods used, but no one is going to jail here either. Personally, I don't see anything wrong with how MLB is pursuing this. As long as the players all are afforded the ability to defend themselves under the terms of the CBA, I don't think they have too much to complain about.

[SeaBird]

But in this instance they are talking about suspending folks that haven't failed a test. The only proof they have is that of Bosch, both his inaccurate document trail and his coerced assistance.

Failing a test isn't the only requirement that needs to be met in order for a player to be found in violation of the drug policy.

[SeaBird]

If they do then they do. They haven't bothered to leak that stuff yet and we know how much they love to leak.

In many cases, "leaks" are, by design, well thought out tests, akin to "trial balloons". "Leaks" are excellent tools that can be used to test the waters or judge or gauge public reaction. You let a little bit of information "slip" out and then evaluate the kind of discussions and reactions it stirs up. Support? Outrage? Supportive reaction to leaked information can go a long way in validating your strategy. Negative reaction to such information might suggest that you re-think and re-tool your strategy or perhaps consider Plan B.

MLB wants to make they've dotted the "I's" and crossed the "T's" and that they have the support of the fans as they move forward in this investigation. Leaking information allows them to tweak the plan as they move forward.