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Jim Johnson the 2013 scapegoat.


mark_beckens

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He is no scapegoat. I have been saying all year Johnson is lousy and I have a list of neg reps to prove it. Forget all the blown saves, it's the throw into centerfield last night that will cost us the playoffs. After that great comeback, as soon as I saw Johnson come in I cringed.

I really hope he is gone, I am sure the rest of the team can't stand him either.

I have not given you any negative rep points, and I really don't believe in them, but I'd venture to say that you get them because of the way in which you express your opinions, not for your opinions themselves (for the most part). A statement like "I am sure that the rest of the team can't stand him" is offensive. Jim Johnson has been on this team a long time, and has been a very good pitcher for most of that time. He's never ducked responsibility when he's had a bad game. I'm sure his teammates probably think very highly of him. Whether he should be back next year is a separate issue.

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Yeah, but that wasn't my point. If a closer comes into a tie game and hits 4 guys in a row, whose fault is it? People can say it is the teams responsibility for not scoring more runs, but the fact is that pitcher knows whose fault it is that the game was lost.

Exactly.

Say, for example, an umpire does not call a clear strike 3 that would have ended the game for the pitching team in the 9th. The batter gets another undeserved pitch that he golfs out of the park for a game winning homer.

On the losing team, could you argue that they would have still won if they converted their RISP opportunities and scored more runs? Sure you could.

But if the ump hadn't blown that call, they would have won, no doubt about it. That team did enough to win today, but didn't due to one individual. Most of the time I feel the same way when the closer blows the game (and especially so if his teammates had no defensive opportunity to prevent it). It's on you because the rest of the team did enough to get to the point that the team should have won.

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Some here think he's the reason we will not make the playoffs. They forget that baseball is a team game and no one player ever wins or loses any game. Yet he seems to take the blunt of the blame. To the point that some are making these kind of excuses for his teammates!

So based on this quote, any run that is given up honestly is ok. It's only the dishonest runs that get a pitcher blamed

I'm confused, does that mean when a starter comes out of the bullpen to start a game, he's not expected to not give up runs? I thought the job of all pitchers was to not give up runs.

Has JJ pitched as well as last season, NO.

Has he had really bad stretches this season, YES.

Does he deserve some of the blame for losses and our mediocre season, YES. However, he is not the reason we won't make the playoffs, if we don't. He is part of the reason. Every player is responsible. Buck and the coaching staff are responsible. DD and the front office are responsible. They all share the blame for every loss and us not being good enough, not playing well enough to win the division, make the playoffs, and win a championship.

Preach it!

Plenty of games were blown by other BP members, our rotation, and sometimes our offense. Closers are just more scrutinized because of when they pitch.

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Exactly.

Say, for example, an umpire does not call a clear strike 3 that would have ended the game for the pitching team in the 9th. The batter gets another undeserved pitch that he golfs out of the park for a game winning homer.

On the losing team, could you argue that they would have still won if they converted their RISP opportunities and scored more runs? Sure you could.

But if the ump hadn't blown that call, they would have won, no doubt about it. That team did enough to win today, but didn't due to one individual. Most of the time I feel the same way when the closer blows the game (and especially so if his teammates had no defensive opportunity to prevent it). It's on you because the rest of the team did enough to get to the point that the team should have won.

I think it's a wrong way to look at it. Closers are going to allow runs occasionally, just like any other pitcher. Do they bear some blame when they do? Sure, but that doesn't make them solely responsible for a team's loss, IMO.

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This gets overlooked a lot. People always assume "these are professionals and they can handle a loss." But you cannot tell me that guys like Jones and Manny who give everything on that field aren't BEYOND pissed right now. They are human after all, and friend or not, JJ has lost them many games.

Do you think guys like Jones and Manny think JJ wasn't giving it everything every time out? What, do you (or they) think Johnson was goofing around, not really caring what happened, and blew all those games on a lark?

I'm sure everyone is mad and disappointed, but I'd be surprised if they're ready to dropkick Johnson out the door. All of them have gone through rough spots, it's just that most of them are lucky that they're not exclusively used in close/late situations.

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This gets overlooked a lot. People always assume "these are professionals and they can handle a loss." But you cannot tell me that guys like Jones and Manny who give everything on that field aren't BEYOND pissed right now. They are human after all, and friend or not, JJ has lost them many games.

Jones didn't exactly tear the cover off the ball this series and was putrid in the playoff series last year on offense and defense. If he has any integrity and I think he does, he will be mad at himself before pointing the finger anywhere else.

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Do you think guys like Jones and Manny think JJ wasn't giving it everything every time out? What, do you (or they) think Johnson was goofing around, not really caring what happened, and blew all those games on a lark?

I'm sure everyone is mad and disappointed, but I'd be surprised if they're ready to dropkick Johnson out the door. All of them have gone through rough spots, it's just that most of them are lucky that they're not exclusively used in close/late situations.

I have NEVER said Johnson is not giving it his all. All I'm saying is these guys are human, and feelings of anger are bound to come up when one guy continually is killing your team.

Do you think the Ravens defense was "okay" with Boller and crew completely ruining the great run they had? I seriously doubt it.

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I have NEVER said Johnson is not giving it his all. All I'm saying is these guys are human, and feelings of anger are bound to come up when one guy continually is killing your team.

Do you think the Ravens defense was "okay" with Boller and crew completely ruining the great run they had? I seriously doubt it.

I don't know anything about the Ravens, but assume their defense was on industrial strength horse steroids and after a loss they weren't particularly happy with their lockers, the stadium, the fans, the cops, the pregame meal, the disposition of their personal butlers, and the weather.

I'm sure the Orioles are generally disappointed with Johnson's results, but how do you react when someone you've been through a lot of stuff with is doing his level best but failing? It's probably some mix of pity, anger, disappointment, hope that he'll get it together... a bunch of stuff. At the end of the season most of them will realize it's a tough game, the other guys are trying their level best to beat you every inning of every game, and it just sucked.

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Let's compare this to Sunday's Bucs/Jets game. Is Lavonte David (the guy who pushed Geno Smith) the reason the Bucs lost?

That was a homer call by the refs. I hate both teams and could care less about that game but that was handed to the Jets,

The OP is nutty as a fruit cake:) JJ needs to go. Everyone knows it but him.

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After one of JJ's recent blown saves in NY, there was a shot of AJ tossing a helmet up and hitting it with his bat.

I sincerely believe that JJ lost the confidence of his teammates. It's not unbelievable to think the feeling of defeat is in the back of the O's hitters' minds when things get tense late. Whereas last season they "knew" they'd win and the magic happened, the exact opposite happened this year. It's a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Hold on now, that AJ hitting his helmet clip wasn't because of a JJ blown save. Jones did that in the same game, but it happened earlier in the game, before JJ blew the save.

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Its just like the Ravens. Is Lee Evans THE only reason we lost the 2011 AFC Championship? No. But we had the chance to win the game at that moment, and he blew it. Regardless of everything else, he had the chance to win the game simply by catching a pass, and HE blew it. Single-handedly. Same applies to JJ.

I thought he caught that and the refs got it wrong.

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He is no scapegoat. I have been saying all year Johnson is lousy and I have a list of neg reps to prove it. Forget all the blown saves, it's the throw into centerfield last night that will cost us the playoffs. After that great comeback, as soon as I saw Johnson come in I cringed.

I really hope he is gone, I am sure the rest of the team can't stand him either.

Yes he is your scape goat. You blame him for everything. Sorry but you deserve

the negative reps. JJ is 85 percent successful. So y

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