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Mussina is significantly better than Glavine


Luper2207

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Really good post on an interesting subject. I think all of the players that you have listed all have Hall of Fame credentials. I think that Pettiite is an interesting case. He somehow gets a pass in the court of public opinion despite his use of PED's. It's probably because of his testimony against Clemens. However, I think that his career should be looked at with the same scrutiny as Clemens. I would be upset if Pettite gets in the Hall of Fame before Clemens.

I put a poll up in the MLB forum.

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Pettite is not a Hall of Famer IMO. He had an ERA over 4 in 9 of his 18 seasons, has thrown 3 complete games since 2004, and has thrown a grand total of 4 shut outs in his career. He should not get in the Hall, and Mussina was 10 times better than him.

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I am not an Andy Petite fan,

But it should be also noted:

He ranks as MLB's all-time postseason wins leader with 19.

only major league pitcher who played at least 18 seasons without having a losing record in any season

He is the only MLB pitcher since 1930 to win at least 12 games in each of his first nine seasons.

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I am not an Andy Petite fan,

But it should be also noted:

He ranks as MLB's all-time postseason wins leader with 19.

only major league pitcher who played at least 18 seasons without having a losing record in any season

He is the only MLB pitcher since 1930 to win at least 12 games in each of his first nine seasons.

Yes Pettite was a pretty good postseason pitcher but not a really great one. He went 19-11 with a 3.81 ERA in the playoffs. Good but not spectacular. That's not enough IMO to overshadow the fact that he was average to mediocre for exactly half of his career.

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Yes Pettite was a pretty good postseason pitcher but not a really great one. He went 19-11 with a 3.81 ERA in the playoffs. Good but not spectacular. That's not enough IMO to overshadow the fact that he was average to mediocre for exactly half of his career.

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I dont believe he belongs in the HOF.

Still. With that I said. I would not call him a mediocre pitcher.

Hard to say about a pitcher that never had a losing season.

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Yes Pettite was a pretty good postseason pitcher but not a really great one. He went 19-11 with a 3.81 ERA in the playoffs. Good but not spectacular. That's not enough IMO to overshadow the fact that he was average to mediocre for exactly half of his career.

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And a PED user. That seems to be a distinction at this point.

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I dont believe he belongs in the HOF.

Still. With that I said. I would not call him a mediocre pitcher.

Hard to say about a pitcher that never had a losing season.

You should know how little most of us value wins on this forum. ;) But I never said he was a mediocre pitcher I just said that that's what he was for half of his career. He was good and occasionally very good for the other 9 years of his career and was good in the postseason as you pointed out.

Overall he was a really good pitcher, just not HOF worthy in my opinion.

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Where Pettitte was phenomenal (other than spending his entire career destroying the Orioles) was always keeping his team in the game. I guess you could say the same for a guy like Morris, but it seemed like he never got blown out. If the Yankees offense was only going to score 1 or 2 runs that day, Pettitte would only give up 1 or 2 runs. I saw SO MANY Pettitte games where I wanted to watch him get blown out and instead he kept throwing quality starts. The Yankees were in every game he pitched and it was annoying as a Yankee hater to watch. I still remember his Game 5 of the 1996 World Series when he beat Smoltz 1-0 in Atlanta. Even in his last season, at 100 years old, it felt like every start of his was a "quality start."

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Matt Keough obviuosly has a lot of confidence.
Perhaps we should pity Keough. Rob Harley, the ex-arm's attorney, has reportedly said that his client has never been the same since he was hit in the head with a foul ball during spring training in 1992, when he was attempting a major league comeback with the Angels.

"He lost all self-respect, his self-esteem," Harley says in wire service accounts of today's sentencing, "and now he's an alcoholic, a caged animal."

He would have fit in well with the Halos.

http://blogs.ocweekly.com/navelgazing/2010/10/matt_keough_year_jail_dui.php

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Where Pettitte was phenomenal (other than spending his entire career destroying the Orioles) was always keeping his team in the game. I guess you could say the same for a guy like Morris, but it seemed like he never got blown out. If the Yankees offense was only going to score 1 or 2 runs that day, Pettitte would only give up 1 or 2 runs. I saw SO MANY Pettitte games where I wanted to watch him get blown out and instead he kept throwing quality starts. The Yankees were in every game he pitched and it was annoying as a Yankee hater to watch. I still remember his Game 5 of the 1996 World Series when he beat Smoltz 1-0 in Atlanta. Even in his last season, at 100 years old, it felt like every start of his was a "quality start."

The thing to note about that Smoltz game, Petite's previous game, he was knocked around for 7 runs in 2 2/3 innings and he bounce right back and went head to head with Smoltz.

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I had forgotten that he was the starter in the Game 1 1996 WS blowout by the Braves. Of course, Games 4 and 5 completely changed that series and naturally he was at his best when it really mattered. I do remember one other start where he was awful....Game 6, 2001 WS. Arizona lit him up.

He may not be a HOFer, but he was a big time pitcher. He really seemed to come through most of the time when needed. And he seemed to do it with one pitch. Kind of like Mariano, just not at THAT level.

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Let's not forget here, Glavine was not a d-bag. Writers have always supported the more popular players. Mu$$ina sold his soul by going to the Yankees and I believe writers hold that against guys. Had Mu$$ina put those numbers up as an Oriole I bet he would have gotten in on the first ballot or at least gotten a lot more votes.

Mu$$ina was a good pitcher, but he's a guy who only finished higher than 5th in the Cy Young twice in his career. He was on loaded Yankee playoff teams and only won 20-games once.

Glavine hit those magic numbers like 300 wins and was a multiple Cy Young award winner and 5-time 20-game winner. That's what a lot of writers look for.

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