Some stuff

[Fan4Life]

I just heard that Gallagher was spotted in the Cub's ST parking lot smashing a watermelon that he had written "Cubs" in big blue letters after which he jumped in his car and sped off. The windows of his car had "Baltimore Bound" written in orange shoe polish on them and empty cans of National Bohemian Beer were hanging off the back bumper. What could all that mean?

Somebody trashed the wrong car?

[davearm]

You actually think that MacPhail is not asking for something similar. I think he is. And I think Hendry is not willing to do that yet. However, if the Cubs get into the pennant race and decide that to go deeper into the playoffs they need a better lead off hitter than Soriano or a better 2B than Derosa, then maybe Hendry increases his offer, if Roberts hasn't been traded by then.

I appreciate your concern for my posts being laughed at, but I doubt that my opinion carries the kind of weight that will be carried to other boards, unless you do the carrying.

I know your opinion is a lot higher on the 0-3 guys I mentioned, but I don't see them as anything more then fill ins until the O's can do better.

Cedeno can't be considered a long term solution when he can't even beat out Theriot.

Patterson doesn't even have a position that people are sure he can handle in the majors.

Murton is a leftfielder (can't play CF or RF adequately) who has had problem driving the ball vs righthanders over his three years in the majors. Scott is probably a better player at the moment.

That is what I see. You high opinion of Murton noted, but not withstanding. So when you say 0-3 major league ready players, you leave out the words that say they all have problems that may prevent them from being major league everyday players. That is why they are available from the Cubs. They are not highly thought of by Cubs managment.

If Patterson, Cedeno, and Murton are so crappy and unwanted, then how about the Cubs just keep them. I'd feel really terrible sticking you with guys you don't want or need.

And in that spirit, adding Jay Payton does not enhance the deal from the Cubs' perspective, it detracts from it.

Speaking of Payton, I seem to recall he has whined about being a part-time player both in Boston and in Baltimore. I'm not convinced Lou Piniella is the cure for that particular malady. To me it seems more likely that copping an attitude will cause Piniella to run Payton right out of town. He's done just that to a few guys already.

If we're getting into 5 guys, then you probably ought to be familiarizing yourselves with guys like Micah Hoffpaiur and Jake Fox. Those are some throwin-grade players. Either that or Jason Marquis.

[Harry Carry]

Rosenbloom the guy who wrote that column has no credibilty his columns are just his opinions he is not even a beet writer for any sport.He is what you call a hack of a reporter.

[Maverick2143]

Rosenbloom the guy who wrote that column has no credibilty his columns are just his opinions he is not even a beet writer for any sport.He is what you call a hack of a reporter.

Well the fact that he doesn't report on the activities of a biennial Eurasian plant doesn't mean that he is not a credible baseball reporter.

[davearm]

Cubs management may think that Payton fills their need for a 4th OF because he can play all three fields better then Murton can. However, I don't see the O's sending much money. That is why I see Payton for Dempster a better fit. Their salaries are similar.

Though Dave has expressed that Dempster is the Cubs #3 starter. I can't take that claim very seriously when they have Zambrano, Lilley and Hill plus Marquis is a better pitcher. Dempster IMO is fighting for the #5 spot versus Marshall and Lieber. I've seem that written several places and also seem that Dempster could possibly be traded.

I don't ever recall expressing that Dempster is the Cubs #3 starter, but whatever. The situation is this.

Zambrano is #1, and Lilly and Hill are the next two. Lieber, Dempster, Marquis are competing for the last two spots. (Marshall is included in that discussion, although personally I doubt he really has much of a chance considering he can be sent to AAA but the others obviously cannot.)

Now it's likely that Piniella will insert the best of Dempster, Lieber, and Marquis in between Lilly and Hill to split up the LHPs, technically making that guy the #3 starter, albeit in name only. Word is that Dempster has the inside track early in camp, enough so that rumors of him being traded have all but vanished.

So in a roundabout and misleading way, I suppose you could consider Dempster the Cubs' #3 starter.

[WebLink21]

Why don't you take it to another message board then?

You are probably going to receive negative feedback for saying something like that to one of the Cubs fans. I don't think you should, but I thought I would give you the heads up.

[Harry Carry]

He is not even a baseball Reporter.He writes I think 1 column a week.He just looks for comedy in every story he writes.The Orioles are scouting Marquis today to see if they want him because they would still be saving money in the deal.I think Marquis has 16 million left.Roberts has about 15 million left and add Paytons 5 million.Marquis like him or not he always pitches well in the 1st half and will give you 200 innings and he wins about 13 games a year.If he stays with the Cubs I hope he has his usual good 1st half then they can deal him and get something for him.I think Marquis would just be the 5th player thrown in.

[LookinUp]

So McPhail is apparently trying to sign Lohse. Fine. To me, that says that all of Penn, Liz, Albers, Gallagher (potentially), Burress and whoever else we've been throwing around as a #5 starter will either be in the bullpen or AAA. If the O's have already decided this it will have an effect on the Cubs trade.

IMO, this could mean we either:

1. Don't sign Lohse and trade for Marshall instead.

2. Sign Lohse and replace Marshall with a prospect.

In other words, I think our evaluations come down to what's better in 2-3 years, Lohse (likely gone soon after arrival) + extra Cubs prospect(s) or Marshall?

I'd note that if we don't think Marshall has much of a chance of helping us in 2-3 years, the answer is obviously the Lohse + prospect angle. If Lohse doesn't sign with us, I guess it's on to Plan B.

[WebLink21]

So McPhail is apparently trying to sign Lohse. Fine. To me, that says that all of Penn, Liz, Albers, Gallagher (potentially), Burress and whoever else we've been throwing around as a #5 starter will either be in the bullpen or AAA. If the O's have already decided this it will have an effect on the Cubs trade.

IMO, this could mean we either:

1. Don't sign Lohse and trade for Marshall instead.

2. Sign Lohse and replace Marshall with a prospect.

In other words, I think our evaluations come down to what's better in 2-3 years, Lohse (likely gone soon after arrival) + extra Cubs prospect(s) or Marshall?

I'd note that if we don't think Marshall has much of a chance of helping us in 2-3 years, the answer is obviously the Lohse + prospect angle. If Lohse doesn't sign with us, I guess it's on to Plan B.

IMO I would rather have Penn, Liz, Albers, Gallagher, or Marshall in the #5 spot rather than signing Lohse. I would rather sink or swim THIS season with our young pitchers. It may be just me, but I would rather see Albers and Penn start the season #4 and #5 than see Trachel and Lohse.

[Harry Carry]

The problem with Lohse as some people have stated he is a me guy that really doesn't care about the team.He complained with Twins,Reds and the Phils. I doubt AM would want that for his young team unless he comes cheaply.

[wildcard]

If Patterson, Cedeno, and Murton are so crappy and unwanted, then how about the Cubs just keep them. I'd feel really terrible sticking you with guys you don't want or need.

And in that spirit, adding Jay Payton does not enhance the deal from the Cubs' perspective, it detracts from it.

Speaking of Payton, I seem to recall he has whined about being a part-time player both in Boston and in Baltimore. I'm not convinced Lou Piniella is the cure for that particular malady. To me it seems more likely that copping an attitude will cause Piniella to run Payton right out of town. He's done just that to a few guys already.

If we're getting into 5 guys, then you probably ought to be familiarizing yourselves with guys like Micah Hoffpaiur and Jake Fox. Those are some throwin-grade players. Either that or Jason Marquis.

You actually make some pretty good points here.

The prospect that Cedeno, Patterson and Murton are not long term everyday players is probably a big reason why this trade has not already been made.

Your point about Payton and Pineilla not being a good match is something to consider but I would bet that Hendry feels that Pineilla will give Payton enough playing time over the rookie in center that its probably will not be a problem. That plus the fact that the RF has never played a game in the MLB. I doubt he plays 162 games.

You are also probably right about the fifth guy being a lesser known player. Heck, I had never heard of Mickolio before the Bedard trade.

All and all a very good post.

[Harry Carry]

If the Cubs take Payton they will either trade him or release him thats just my opinion.

[Baroquen131]

I don't ever recall expressing that Dempster is the Cubs #3 starter, but whatever. The situation is this.

Zambrano is #1, and Lilly and Hill are the next two. Lieber, Dempster, Marquis are competing for the last two spots. (Marshall is included in that discussion, although personally I doubt he really has much of a chance considering he can be sent to AAA but the others obviously cannot.)

Now it's likely that Piniella will insert the best of Dempster, Lieber, and Marquis in between Lilly and Hill to split up the LHPs, technically making that guy the #3 starter, albeit in name only. Word is that Dempster has the inside track early in camp, enough so that rumors of him being traded have all but vanished.

So in a roundabout and misleading way, I suppose you could consider Dempster the Cubs' #3 starter.

davearm's right. It was Cubsfan that Wildcard was arguing with about Dempster as a #3 starter. The reply in question here.

I wouldn't surprise me to see Roberts stay, or go tomorrow. I doubt Dempster is part of the picture though.

[wildcard]

davearm's right. It was Cubsfan that Wildcard was arguing with about Dempster as a #3 starter. The reply in question here.

I wouldn't surprise me to see Roberts stay, or go tomorrow. I doubt Dempster is part of the picture though.

Thank you for the correction. I was not about to wade through that 600 posts for the answer.

My apologies for Davearm. It was another Cub's fan that said that Dempster was the Cub's #3.

[nyjimbo]

You are probably going to receive negative feedback for saying something like that to one of the Cubs fans. I don't think you should, but I thought I would give you the heads up.

Thats what I thought, BUT I wasn't the one bring up other message boards.