Francoeur says "We owe those guys an ass-whuppin to be honest with you."

[CA-ORIOLE]

If Macphail can fix that mess,then I have to say he's the Larry Brown of baseball GM's.

When you're rock bottom there is nowhere to go but up.

[Redskins Rick]

If Macphail can fix that mess,then I have to say he's the Larry Brown of baseball GM's.

When you're rock bottom there is nowhere to go but up.

I don't personally know the guy, but some guys love a "big" challenge, and the bigger the disaster the better they like it.

[Satyr3206]

The people deserving the butt whippin are the Owner and GM of the Phillies.

[Redskins Rick]

The people deserving the butt whippin are the Owner and GM of the Phillies.

Pat Gillick is a sound baseball man, so you think, this must be the results of what he is being told to do.

[Orioles Jim]

In fairness, if they had a GM with an ounce of common sense that payroll would be significantly lower. The smartest thing the Red Sox did was getting the Dodgers to eat all their dead money or they would be the Phillies right now. Amaro is an idiot for holding on to the guys he did as long as he did.

Some here used the Phillies as an example of the rationale for not handing Cruz/Markakis/Miller blank checks this offseason.

Hard to argue with that.

[Satyr3206]

Pat Gillick is a sound baseball man, so you think, this must be the results of what he is being told to do.

It was a joke more than anything. Gillick is pretty good. But it is sort of amazing how quick they went from a good team to old and expensive.

[Barnaby Graves]

But it is sort of amazing how quick they went from a good team to old and expensive.

Not really. Not to anyone who was paying attention when they were signing these guys. But the thing is, this isn't just a matter of blocking young guys with old overpaid vets, the fact is that they still haven't developed any significant young talent for spots that are actually open. You can be old and expensive and still win (see "Yankees, New York") because you make a few great call-ups. The Phillies' entire franchise seems to have no upside.

[weams]

Not really. Not to anyone who was paying attention when they were signing these guys. But the thing is, this isn't just a matter of blocking young guys with old overpaid vets, the fact is that they still haven't developed any significant young talent for spots that are actually open. You can be old and expensive and still win (see "Yankees, New York") because you make a few great call-ups. The Phillies' entire franchise seems to have no upside.

Unless you have unlimited funds to simply walk away from these contracts and pay the lux tax forever, the model does not work. Can it get you a Ring? Absolutely.

[weams]

Pat Gillick is a sound baseball man, so you think, this must be the results of what he is being told to do.

Gillick is not the GM.

[Barnaby Graves]

Unless you have unlimited funds to simply walk away from these contracts and pay the lux tax forever, the model does not work. Can it get you a Ring? Absolutely.

Yankees still had Gardner, Betances, Robertson, and a handful of others over the last couple of years. But yeah they laugh at tax issues.

[Crazysilver03]

Yeh, there were a lot of people that knew this was coming with the Phillies. They are so screwed now. A good GM can make them respectable in 3-5 years, but actually being good is way out unless they hit on a ton of draft picks. They honestly don't even have much to trade for a lot of young talent. They have been about as misrun as any franchise ever IMHO.

I had never heard of most of the guys in their bullpen last night. And the majority of them sound like guys they picked up at Home Depot looking for work.

Sent from my LG-D850 using Tapatalk

[Palmoripken]

They actually remind me a lot of where we were in the late 90's almost and why I've come to understand the Angelos's reluctance to give huge contracts for a large amount of years. Obviously you want to lock up key guys but they definitely fouled up in Philly and it's costing them big time right now. The owner should have fired Amaro already but hasn't. I think Philly can be respectable again within 4 years or so but they need a savvy GM. The other thing that happened I think with them is some of their draft picks disappointed. I saw Dominic Brown last night and I remember when he was a huge prospect.

[Frobby]

Yeh, there were a lot of people that knew this was coming with the Phillies. They are so screwed now. A good GM can make them respectable in 3-5 years, but actually being good is way out unless they hit on a ton of draft picks. They honestly don't even have much to trade for a lot of young talent. They have been about as misrun as any franchise ever IMHO.

What they do have is the ability to spend a lot of money. If they spend it more wisely than they did the last time around, they could get respectable more quickly than you might think.

[Orioles Jim]

That...probably wasn't what he had in mind.

[Machado13]

They actually remind me a lot of where we were in the late 90's almost and why I've come to understand the Angelos's reluctance to give huge contracts for a large amount of years. Obviously you want to lock up key guys but they definitely fouled up in Philly and it's costing them big time right now. The owner should have fired Amaro already but hasn't. I think Philly can be respectable again within 4 years or so but they need a savvy GM. The other thing that happened I think with them is some of their draft picks disappointed. I saw Dominic Brown last night and I remember when he was a huge prospect.

I would still take a WS title and what they are rebuilding from.

For whatever reason, if you don't spend $$ you don't win. Sure teams like rays or royals can get to series but I can't remember the last moderate to low payroll to win it all.

Perhaps white sox? And 2003 marlins before then...