The Win rule for pitchers needs to be changed

[brooks1083]

I don't want to get rid of it, but I think it's crazy that a guy can throw 4 2/3 innings, keep his team in it but another guy could potentially come in, throw one pitch and get the W. It's about as crazy as a guy getting a SV in a 30-3 game.

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[crissfan172]

It's a team sport.

I have no idea what the records of any of our starters are, but I know the Orioles are 14-8, and that's all I care about.

[Jagwar]

I think the official scorer should have the ability to give the W to any pitcher in the game. I also think that if a pitcher givew up an earned run and blows the lead, they should not get the win.

[sportsfan8703]

I think the official scorer should have the ability to give the W to any pitcher in the game. I also think that if a pitcher givew up an earned run and blows the lead, they should not get the win.

The official scorer should have this power. They get to determine hits and errors. One argument could be that the MLBPA wants the win rule left alone for salary arguments. But it would actually help SP's get more W's. Relievers aren't really judged on W's. They are more judged on holds and saves.

[Jagwar]

The official scorer should have this power. They get to determine hits and errors. One argument could be that the MLBPA wants the win rule left alone for salary arguments. But it would actually help SP's get more W's. Relievers aren't really judged on W's. They are more judged on holds and saves.

I agree. An example... If a pitcher starts and goes 4 innings, and the team gets the lead, then you have 5 pitchers who each go 1 inning and never relinquish the lead, didn't that starting pitcher have the biggest pitching impact in winning the game?

[thezeroes]

I don't want to get rid of it, but I think it's crazy that a guy can throw 4 2/3 innings, keep his team in it but another guy could potentially come in, throw one pitch and get the W. It's about as crazy as a guy getting a SV in a 30-3 game.

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This would have to be a pitcher that went three innings or more to preserve the win. This "Save" would be earned IMO. Saved the bullpen and did not allow the opponent to get back into the game so "Save" earned.

[Tx Oriole]

As soon as Brach gave up that home run. I knew the O's were going to score in the bottom half of the inning and get Brach the W. I can see them going to "give it to whoever you feel should get it" but that would cause controversies and you need a set definition of a win

I don't care. The O's won. It doesn't matter to me who gets the credit.

[El Gordo]

How about the W goes to the pitcher with the most innings held with the lead. Under that rule Wright would have got the W yesterday.

[thezeroes]

10.17 Winning And Losing Pitcher

(a) The official scorer shall credit as the winning pitcher that pitcher whose team assumes a lead while such pitcher is in the game, or during the inning on offense in which such pitcher is removed from the game, and does not relinquish such lead, unless

(1) such pitcher is a starting pitcher and Rule 10.17(b) applies; or

(2) Rule 10.17© applies.

Rule 10.17(a) Comment: Whenever the score is tied, the game becomes a new contest insofar as the winning pitcher is concerned. Once the opposing team assumes the lead, all pitchers who have pitched up to that point and have been replaced are excluded from being credited with the victory. If the pitcher against whose pitching the opposing team gained the lead continues to pitch until his team regains the lead, which it holds to the finish of the game, that pitcher shall be the winning pitcher.

(b) If the pitcher whose team assumes a lead while such pitcher is in the game, or during the inning on offense in which such pitcher is removed from the game, and does not relinquish such lead, is a starting pitcher who has not completed

(1) five innings of a game that lasts six or more innings on defense, or

(2) four innings of a game that lasts five innings on defense, then the official scorer shall credit as the winning pitcher the relief pitcher, if there is only one relief pitcher, or the relief pitcher who, in the official scorer?s judgment was the most effective, if there is more than one relief pitcher.

Rule 10.17(b) Comment: It is the intent of Rule 10.17(b) that a relief pitcher pitch at least one complete inning or pitch when a crucial out is made, within the context of the game (including the score), in order to be credited as the winning pitcher. If the first relief pitcher pitches effectively, the official scorer should not presumptively credit that pitcher with the win, because the rule requires that the win be credited to the pitcher who was the most effective, and a subsequent relief pitcher may have been most effective. The official scorer, in determining which relief pitcher was the most effective, should consider the number of runs, earned runs and base runners given up by each relief pitcher and the context of the game at the time of each relief pitcher?s appearance. If two or more relief pitchers were similarly effective, the official scorer should give the presumption to the earlier pitcher as the winning pitcher.

© The official scorer shall not credit as the winning pitcher a relief pitcher who is ineffective in a brief appearance, when at least one succeeding relief pitcher pitches effectively in helping his team maintain its lead. In such a case, the official scorer shall credit as the winning pitcher the succeeding relief pitcher who was most effective, in the judgment of the official scorer.

Rule 10.17© Comment: The official scorer generally should, but is not required to, consider the appearance of a relief pitcher to be ineffective and brief if such relief pitcher pitches less than one inning and allows two or more earned runs to score (even if such runs are charged to a previous pitcher). Rule 10.17(b) Comment provides guidance on choosing the winning pitcher from among several succeeding relief pitchers.

(d) A losing pitcher is a pitcher who is responsible for the run that gives the winning team a lead that the winning team does not relinquish.

Rule 10.17(d) Comment: Whenever the score is tied, the game becomes a new contest insofar as the losing pitcher is concerned.

(e) A league may designate a non-championship game (for example, the Major League All-Star Game) for which Rules 10.17(a)(1) and 10.17(b) do not apply. In such games, the official scorer shall credit as the winning pitcher that pitcher whose team assumes a lead while such pitcher is in the game, or during the inning on offense in which such pitcher is removed from the game, and does not relinquish such lead, unless such pitcher is knocked out after the winning team has attained a commanding lead and the official scorer concludes that a subsequent pitcher is entitled to credit as the winning pitcher.

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/official_info/official_rules/official_scorer_10.jsp

[duffaphonic]

Phil Reagan of the LA Dodgers was the original Vulture. In a team sport the team , not any one player, wins or loses. The win-loss stat can sometimes tell you about a pitcher's character if he toughs out a 6-5 win while pitching 7-8 innings and doesn't have good stuff. Other than that it's meaningless.

[Crabcakes]

The Rule is fair. If you think it was applied unfairly, that he was still capable of getting the opposition out, then your beef should be with the manager that pulled him out of the game too soon.

....just saying....