Duquette Run Is Over

[atomic]

I agree that whether a prospect succeeds or fails is perhaps not the best way to judge whether you got value for the trade when it occurred. But you don't need to factor in what Hader is currently doing to hate the Norris trade. Bud Norris was a below average pitcher then and now. And we paid him the market rate for his productivity' date=' AND gave up prospects and draft picks for the privilege of paying him that rate. There was no meat left on the bone of his contract when we made the trade. It was a bad trade the second we made it, independent of anything Hader has since done.[/quote']

Norris had a 1.9 WAR season the year after the trade. If we can make a similar trade for a starter that can put up a 1.9 WAR season I would say make it.

[24fps]

Norris had a 1.9 WAR season the year after the trade. If we can make a similar trade for a starter that can put up a 1.9 WAR season I would say make it.

No brainer. Subject, of course, to endless second-guessing for the next three decades.

[ArtVanDelay]

Plenty of pitchers do well in AA and stink in the majors. The point is 4 years after the trade and he hasn't made it above AA and you would think the way people on here talk he is a combination of Mike Trout and David Price. Why do you guys follow his career so closely? I am guessing you guys are hoping he becomes an ace so you can continue to complain about if for years to come. And the Arreita thing.. He was pitching like Jimenez is now.

Is this serious? Most people on this board enjoy the game of baseball and keep up with players/teams around the league, not just the Orioles. You should try it.

[ArtVanDelay]

The same Josh Hader that is doing his 3rd year of AA ball? :scratchchinhmm:

Saying it's his 3rd year of AA ball is pretty misleading.

In 2014, he pitched 22 games in A and 5 games in AA. He then spent the whole 2015 season in AA, and in 2016 he's made 10 starts in AA.

So it's basically a season and a half when you put it all together. He'll probably be called up to the bigs and skip AAA. He deserves to be there already. Super 2 is probably why he's still down there.

[Redskins Rick]

Saying it's his 3rd year of AA ball is pretty misleading.

In 2014, he pitched 22 games in A and 5 games in AA. He then spent the whole 2015 season in AA, and in 2016 he's made 10 starts in AA.

So it's basically a season and a half when you put it all together. He'll probably be called up to the bigs and skip AAA. He deserves to be there already. Super 2 is probably why he's still down there.

Okay, sorry, his 3rd season of AA ball. He earned a promotion mid season, and he spent the entire 2nd year in AA, and now is repeating AA. Maybe, because he didn't stay a starter in year 2 and had some bullpen duty.

Super 2 has no impact on why he isn't good enough to be at AAA, facing better hitters.

Most pitchers don't skip AAA on the way through the process of developing into a major league pitcher.

[atomic]

Is this serious? Most people on this board enjoy the game of baseball and keep up with players/teams around the league, not just the Orioles. You should try it.

So you are saying in addition to following all the guys on the three major top 100 prospects lists. All the Orioles minor league players ..you follow every minor leaguer in baseball? I am calling BS. I think you guys just like to whine about stuff.

[Redskins Rick]

So you are saying in addition to following all the guys on the three major top 100 prospects lists. All the Orioles minor league players ..you follow every minor leaguer in baseball? I am calling BS. I think you guys just like to whine about stuff.

I agree, some of have a life too, I read HBT and MLBTR, hard to follow other teams like I do the Orioles, not to mention some of us, also follow a bit of the NFL.

[ArtVanDelay]

So you are saying in addition to following all the guys on the three major top 100 prospects lists. All the Orioles minor league players ..you follow every minor leaguer in baseball? I am calling BS. I think you guys just like to whine about stuff.

Lol wtf. Where did I say that I follow every minor leaguer in baseball?

[ArtVanDelay]

Okay, sorry, his 3rd season of AA ball. He earned a promotion mid season, and he spent the entire 2nd year in AA, and now is repeating AA. Maybe, because he didn't stay a starter in year 2 and had some bullpen duty.

Super 2 has no impact on why he isn't good enough to be at AAA, facing better hitters.

Most pitchers don't skip AAA on the way through the process of developing into a major league pitcher.

Some prospects don't need AAA. A lot go right from AA to the majors. Corn posted an article about the Brewers AAA affiliate in Colorado Springs. But you'll probably keep ignoring that.

[24fps]

So you are saying in addition to following all the guys on the three major top 100 prospects lists. All the Orioles minor league players ..you follow every minor leaguer in baseball? I am calling BS. I think you guys just like to whine about stuff.

I don't think anybody is saying anything close to that. Nonetheless there are people who post here whose knowledge of the minor leagues is pretty broad. I think you are underestimating them and quite a few others as well.

[Redskins Rick]

Some prospects don't need AAA. A lot go right from AA to the majors. Corn posted an article about the Brewers AAA affiliate in Colorado Springs. But you'll probably keep ignoring that.

Nope, didn't ignore it, hadn't seen it, went back and read it, and it could very well have impact.

[ArtVanDelay]

Okay, sorry, his 3rd season of AA ball. He earned a promotion mid season, and he spent the entire 2nd year in AA, and now is repeating AA. Maybe, because he didn't stay a starter in year 2 and had some bullpen duty.

Super 2 has no impact on why he isn't good enough to be at AAA, facing better hitters.

Most pitchers don't skip AAA on the way through the process of developing into a major league pitcher.

BTW, even the great Julio Urias has pitched out of the bullpen in the minors this season and previously. It's a way to limit their innings because they aren't nearly ready to throw 200 yet.

Hader is still younger than the average AA player by 2.3 years. And he's been completely dominant this year after being excellent last year. To say he hasn't earned a promotion is absurd. You have no idea why they still have him in AA.

[foxfield]

Lol wtf. Where did I say that I follow every minor leaguer in baseball?

Is this serious? Most people on this board enjoy the game of baseball and keep up with players/teams around the league, not just the Orioles. You should try it.

Well, I can kinda sorta see how someone might, you know, feel like that was the implication.

Look, I liked Hader, but we made a trade and got 2war out of it. Fangraphs still only grades him as a 50 which after careful analysis, means his upside is that he could suck pretty much like anyone on the roster not named Tillman or Gausman. I've moved on. You should try it.

[ArtVanDelay]

Well, I can kinda sorta see how someone might, you know, feel like that was the implication.

Look, I liked Hader, but we made a trade and got 2war out of it. Fangraphs still only grades him as a 50 which after careful analysis, means his upside is that he could suck pretty much like anyone on the roster not named Tillman or Gausman. I've moved on. You should try it.

I can't. I never said anything close to "I follow every minor leaguer in baseball".

[Rene88]

I can't. I never said anything close to "I follow every minor leaguer in baseball".

On a related note, I am a huge David Hess fan. Any thoughts on him? I go to a lot of Bowie games (going this weekend) and like to see them do well.

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