How has Gausman gotten this screwed up?

[FanSince88]

Just now, sportsfan8703 said:

 

Exactly.  It's on the players.  Gausman isn't the B word, he's the S word.  Soft.  Sounds like Wright is too.  After rereading that article by Rosenthal it sounds like Brady is coddling these guys and that Wallace and Chiti were telling them what they needed to do.   

Right.  So while you can probably pin some of the blame on the pitching staff for not pushing Gausman/Wright hard enough, at the end of the day the responsibility is on the player to push HIMSELF, regardless of who his coach is.  These aren't 12 year old boys we're talking about.  These are grown men who have already made more money than many of us will make in our lives.  

[webbrick2010]

1 hour ago, sportsfan8703 said:

If we had any type of SP depth Gausman would be in the pen right now.  Unfortunately 3/5 of the situation is in shambles.  We not only don't have SP at the MLB level, we don't have SP in the minors either.  

Isn't it 4/5 in shambles... Miley is turning back to the same terrible pitcher he has been for 2+ seasons.

In fact Ubaldo may be the second best starter we have.... and if that doesn't really frame what a dissaster this rotation is.

[FanSince88]

4 minutes ago, Tbone83 said:

Does he really though? He has had some nice stretches but I don't think Gausman has ever had enough sustained success to say he has a positive track record. I remember Jake having a few nice stretches too, but, like Kevin, the bad kept coming back. Gausman has slightly better numbers overall than Jake (as an Oriole) but I think the two are quite comparable.

Gausman's worst season WHIP pre-17 is still lower than Arrieta's best WHIP in an Orioles uniform.  All of Gausman's season ERAs from 2014-2016 were much lower than all of Arrieta's season ERAs as an Oriole.  Gausman's FIP was also consistently 4.10 or lower whereas Arrieta only got below 4.10 once in an Orioles uniform.  I don't think it is very close at all -- Gausman's track record as an Oriole has been massively more promising before 2017, in terms of actual results, than Arrieta's ever was.  

[thezeroes]

Jake Arrieta 20 Wins 25 Losses as an Oriole

Kevin Gausman 26 Wins 35 Losses as an Oriole

Jake Arrieta 5.46 ERA, 358 Innings Pitched, 1.472 WHIP, 63 Games Started

Kevin Gausman 4.21 ERA, 519 Innings Pitched, 1.347 WHIP, 85 Games Started.

Jake Arrieta 9.3 H/9, 4 w/9, 7 k/9, 1.2 HR/9

Kevin Gausman 9.4 H/9, 2.7 w/9, 8 k/9, 1.2 HR/9

[Going Underground]

37 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

http://www.foxsports.com/mlb/story/brady-andersons-role-with-orioles-a-topic-of-debate-032017

“I like Brady. Everybody likes Brady,” former pitching coach Dave Wallace said. “But one of the problems is, when you have a role in an organization where you have total autonomy and really no accountability, that’s tough.”

"Wallace, 70, and bullpen coach Dom Chiti, 57, both left Showalter’s staff after three years at the end of last season, in part due to what Wallace described as Anderson’s rising influence and interference.

Wallace said that he had planned to retire from major-league coaching, but that Anderson was part of the reason he resisted overtures to remain with the Orioles in a player-development role.

Chiti said, “I’m not going to deny that Brady was part of why I left,” but declined further comment.

Both Wallace and Chiti signed two-year contracts to return to the Braves, for whom each had worked just before joining the Orioles. Chiti became the Braves’ director of pitching, Wallace a special assistant who will focus on pitching."

 

I know some of the  pitching coaches were more old school and not as much of a fan of Brady's conditioning program for pitchers. 

[eddie83]

Just now, Going Underground said:

I know some of the  pitching coaches were more old school and not as much of a fan of Brady's conditioning program for pitchers. 

Wallace was done at the MLB level either way. Who knows if Chiti stays if things are better. 

No question this organization needs to step up and work in unison. 

[sportsfan8703]

7 minutes ago, thezeroes said:

Jake Arrieta 20 Wins 25 Losses as an Oriole

Kevin Gausman 26 Wins 35 Losses as an Oriole

Jake Arrieta 5.46 ERA, 358 Innings Pitched, 1.472 WHIP, 63 Games Started

Kevin Gausman 4.21 ERA, 519 Innings Pitched, 1.347 WHIP, 85 Games Started.

Jake Arrieta 9.3 H/9, 4 w/9, 7 k/9, 1.2 HR/9

Kevin Gausman 9.4 H/9, 2.7 w/9, 8 k/9, 1.2 HR/9

Scary similar.  What the heck happened to Gausman?  Gausman has had to be rocked around the last 66 IP to have a 4.21 ERA.  

It's frustrating because much of the organization's problems is lack of talent.  Then when we get a guy like Gausman we can't get him over the hump.  

[thezeroes]

52 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Gausman has had to be rocked around the last 66 IP to have a 4.21 ERA.  

Before this year started 23 W- 31L, 3.97 ERA, 72 GS, 1.283 WHIP, 453 IP,

[JohnD]

I have a hard time comparing Arrieta and Gausman simply because for Jake there was universal acclaim for his stuff snd concern with his ability to command it.  He simply struggled to polish what was considered first round ability.

Gausman has never really been lauded for anything more than his fastball and his potential. He may end up being a solid starter when it's all said and done but it hasn't happened yet and there is enough reason to think it may not.  He has to really be on every time if he isn't going to throw better secondary pitches.  And right now it's too much grooving happening.

[Going Underground]

Plate umpire Alan Porter did a little squeezing, but Gausman conceded that he wasn’t sharp enough to warrant the close calls.

See it is the umpire that has Gausman screwed up. That is the problem. Roch explaining what is wrong with Gausman. Thank you,Roch. Now you know. 

 

http://www.masnsports.com/school-of-roch/2017/06/jones-just-keep-your-heads-up-keep-grinding.html

 

[Nevermore]

9 hours ago, webbrick2010 said:

Isn't it 4/5 in shambles... Miley is turning back to the same terrible pitcher he has been for 2+ seasons.

In fact Ubaldo may be the second best starter we have.... and if that doesn't really frame what a dissaster this rotation is.

Ubaldo  hasn't been in a game since who - knows - when. He wasn't part of the weekend 's disaster . Maybe they should give him a spot start? 

[Frobby]

10 hours ago, Tbone83 said:

Does he really though? He has had some nice stretches but I don't think Gausman has ever had enough sustained success to say he has a positive track record. I remember Jake having a few nice stretches too, but, like Kevin, the bad kept coming back. Gausman has slightly better numbers overall than Jake (as an Oriole) but I think the two are quite comparable.

Gausman: 4.31 ERA (3.97 going into 2017).

Arrieta: 5.46 ERA as an Oriole.

I don't see the comparison at all.   Arrieta's best ERA as an Oriole was 4.66, and his ERA got worse each year he was on the team.    Gausman had a 3.61 ERA last year, and 3.57 in 2014.

Gausman, by any reasonable measure, was an above average major league starter last year, and he finished the season very strong.   To see him just falling apart this year astounds me.    

[Larry18]

50 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Gausman: 4.31 ERA (3.97 going into 2017).

Arrieta: 5.46 ERA as an Oriole.

I don't see the comparison at all.   Arrieta's best ERA as an Oriole was 4.66, and his ERA got worse each year he was on the team.    Gausman had a 3.61 ERA last year, and 3.57 in 2014.

Gausman, by any reasonable measure, was an above average major league starter last year, and he finished the season very strong.   To see him just falling apart this year astounds me.    

The pitching staff have no safety net. Wallace,Chiti,Peterson and Wieters knew the staff and had their trust. It is unreasonable to expect McDowell,Mills,Wasdin and Castillo to be able to have the same level of trust in 3 months. I'm not a fan of McDowell but he isn't the person that decided the 4 most important resources that pitchers have could be replaced all at once.

[Tbone83]

We can argue numbers, but the bottom line is that Jake and Kevin both have talent and potential, but neither has/was able to harness it over a sustained period in Baltimore. Yes, Gausman had a nice stretch last year. But he had struggles before that and is massively struggling this year. 

[FlipTheBird]

13 minutes ago, Tbone83 said:

We can argue numbers, but the bottom line is that Jake and Kevin both have talent and potential, but neither has/was able to harness it over a sustained period in Baltimore. Yes, Gausman had a nice stretch last year. But he had struggles before that and is massively struggling this year. 

You could say that about any one of dozens of pitchers from the last decade. Gausman and Arrieta are not the same player. Kevin has had much more success in the orange and black than Arrieta ever did.