Chris Davis Has Cleared Revocable waivers

[glenn__davis]

I think he'll have at least 1 pretty good year thrown in there.  

When the contract was signed, I was hoping for 2-3 decent years out of the 7.  That's just the type of player he is.  Now that we're just about through 2 years that seems unlikely.  

I will say that unlike some of those other big lumbering 1st basemen, I think Davis is a better overall athlete, so I think it's just as likely that big year comes in year 5 or 6 as year 1 or 2.  There's really no rhyme or reason with him, but I do think we'll have at least 1 year where we're glad he's on the team.  Worth the contract?  No way, but I don't think he's done being productive by any stretch.

[ChuckS]

8 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

It wasn't a non-baseball person that made this decision from everything I've heard. It was a baseball person, just not Duquette.

Not Angelos?  I thought reports were that the money was only available for Davis.  

[Frobby]

12 minutes ago, ChuckS said:

So it will be among the worst in major league history.  I'd be surprised if Davis didn't have some negative WAR numbers in the last few years of that contract.  

My point being, is that there have been dozens of long term contracts signed and Davis will be among the worst by the end.  Three of those guys you listed were signed by the Dodgers by the way, who play with monopoly money.  Also, not fair IMO to include Hamilton and Fielder in there because of injuries.

The Orioles should have known what they were getting into. But when a non-baseball person calls the shots, I guess these things happen. 

In my mind it's fair to include Hamilton and Fielder, who had some known risks when signed.   You're wrong that the Dodgers signed three of the players I listed -- Kemp was the only Dodger signing that I mentioned.     He was signed before the Dodgers were purchased by the current group, so the "monopoly money" point doesn't really apply.  

But let's not pick nits.    I agree with your point that the Davis deal is likely to turn out to be one of the worst ever.    I hope he rebounds and that doesn't turn out to be the case, but the last few years of this deal always figured to be losers, and we're not getting enough value on the front end.    

[Tony-OH]

1 minute ago, ChuckS said:

Not Angelos?  I thought reports were that the money was only available for Davis.  

Angelos may have made the money available, but it was under the advisement of the other GMs in the organization, not Duquette who wasn't going to pay him even close to that amount.

[ChuckS]

8 minutes ago, Frobby said:

In my mind it's fair to include Hamilton and Fielder, who had some known risks when signed.   You're wrong that the Dodgers signed three of the players I listed -- Kemp was the only Dodger signing that I mentioned.     He was signed before the Dodgers were purchased by the current group, so the "monopoly money" point doesn't really apply.  

But let's not pick nits.    I agree with your point that the Davis deal is likely to turn out to be one of the worst ever.    I hope he rebounds and that doesn't turn out to be the case, but the last few years of this deal always figured to be losers, and we're not getting enough value on the front end.    

I meant to say two - not three Dodgers.  I forgot that Crawford was initially signed by the Red Sox. 

[ChuckS]

8 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Angelos may have made the money available, but it was under the advisement of the other GMs in the organization, not Duquette who wasn't going to pay him even close to that amount.

I'm curious as to who the other GM's in the organization are.  Brady?

[Tony-OH]

4 minutes ago, ChuckS said:

I'm curious as to who the other GM's in the organization are.  Brady?

Can't go into much detail at this point. Let's just say there is no clear chain of command and that Buck may have as much, or more power than Duquette with Angelos. A lot of the ire has been dropped on Duquette, some of it deserved, but there are multiple puppet masters once again within the organization.

Basically, a typical Angelos front office, just different players.

[Frobby]

8 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Angelos may have made the money available, but it was under the advisement of the other GMs in the organization, not Duquette who wasn't going to pay him even close to that amount.

What other GM's in the organization?    Do you mean Brady?    Is that something that has been reported somewhere, or something you've heard elsewhere?

Edit - never mind, just saw your post answering another poster's similar question.   

[ChuckS]

12 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Can't go into much detail at this point. Let's just say there is no clear chain of command and that Buck may have as much, or more power than Duquette with Angelos. A lot of the ire has been dropped on Duquette, some of it deserved, but there are multiple puppet masters once again within the organization.

Basically, a typical Angelos front office, just different players.

Well that makes sense.  Why wouldn't a manager known for sticking with his vets too long be in favor of signing one to a contract way past his productive years?

 

[Frobby]

12 minutes ago, ChuckS said:

Well that makes sense.  Why wouldn't a manager known for sticking with his vets too long be in favor of signing one to a contract way past his productive years?

 

To me, this ultimately falls on Angelos.    A manager can give his input as to the value of a player, but he's not in a position to decide how many years a player should get and at what price, nor can a manager be expected to think about the other spending priorities the team may have.    

Tony has given hints, but I'd caution against any narrative that this is somehow Buck's fault, unless a lot more information is forthcoming.    

[Aristotelian]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

There are a few deals that are probably worse than Davis'.     Davis has been worth 3.2 rWAR so far, and it's hard to know if he'll be net positive WAR or negative in the future.    But here's a few stinkers:

- Ryan Howard, $125 mm, -4.5 rWAR.

- Carl Crawford, $142 mm, 3.4 rWAR.

- Prince Fielder, $214 mm, 7.0 rWAR.

- Matt Kemp, $160 mm, 3.9 rWAR (one year remaining).

- Josh Hamilton, $125 mm, 3.4 rWAR.

 

The back end of Pujols is looking pretty bad. -1.6 WAR this year with 4 more years left at $28.5M each and it's not like the front end has been that great. 

[Tony-OH]

33 minutes ago, Frobby said:

To me, this ultimately falls on Angelos.    A manager can give his input as to the value of a player, but he's not in a position to decide how many years a player should get and at what price, nor can a manager be expected to think about the other spending priorities the team may have.    

Tony has given hints, but I'd caution against any narrative that this is somehow Buck's fault, unless a lot more information is forthcoming.    

You can believe any narrative you want, but the Warehouse is basically a Game of Thrones episode without the dragons and violence. haha

[Frobby]

8 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

You can believe any narrative you want, but the Warehouse is basically a Game of Thrones episode without the dragons and violence. haha

You know a lot more than the rest of us, and it's frustrating to me (though perfectly understandable) that you aren't in a position to get into specifics about it.

While I have no personal ill will towards PA, I hope that the next owner will set up a clear chain of command and enforce it.    

[AnythingO's]

3 hours ago, Enjoy Terror said:

Contract isn't untouchable if you think Davis can get you another untouchable contract.

OK, Davis (we pay deferred$) to Detroit for Verlander straight up. Do you do it?

[MDtransplant757]

3 hours ago, Enjoy Terror said:

Contract isn't untouchable if you think Davis can get you another untouchable contract.

Verlander