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Trade Machado, Schoop......

vab

By vab
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ORIOLE33 Major Leaguer Rising Star

ORIOLE33

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24 minutes ago, El Gordo said:

Buck built World Series Championship teams for the New York Yankees, Arizona Diamondbacks and Texas Rangers.  The problem was, Buck was never around to see the teams that he built actually win the World Series.  In each case, Buck was fired and his successor enjoyed the fruits of Buck’s labor.

Buck is a manager that can build a culture, but can't finish the deal. It has happened 3 times. That cannot be a coincidence.

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El Gordo Hangout Grand Counsel

El Gordo

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Just now, ORIOLE33 said:

Buck is a manager that can build a culture, but can't finish the deal. It has happened 3 times. That cannot be a coincidence.

A younger Buck built teams that went on to win WS. He was fired because he was too much a micro manager to maintain a good clubhouse environment. Clearly he has grown in that regard, He has a great club house here, and as a GM he wouldn't be managing  the team day to day. I feel confident that he could quickly build a competitive team Also he is the best bet among G's would would work for PA.

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Can_of_corn Hangout Grand Counsel

Can_of_corn

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2 minutes ago, Cumberbundy said:

GM Buck would make me very happy. He seems like a guy who would thrive in the position he loves watching the lower level guys & he knows the game as well as just about anyone. I want Buck to be with the O's for a long time. 

I think he is too loyal to his guys.

Do we want to see a repeat of O'Day and Davis when Jones comes up for free agency?

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tntoriole Hangout Grand Counsel

tntoriole

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See if you can sign Schoop to an extension BEFORE you make the big pitch to Manny this offseason.   And then trade Manny if we cannot sign him.   But I am keeping Schoop either way.   But, in reality, I think Manny is going to go through free agency at this point (Schoop or not, our offer or not).   I advocated for trading him last winter, but, clearly, we did not and have had this pennant winning season..oops, sorry...  I realize second guessing is easy and it would have been very high wire risk taking to do it last winter, but the fact is his value now is much, much less than it would have been then and the return trade value clock continues to just be ticking away.   If it gets to the trade deadline next year, we will be lucky to get any decent prospects in return because teams will know that we are over the proverbial barrel.    

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Cumberbundy Hangout Veteran Council

Cumberbundy

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Just now, Can_of_corn said:

I think he is too loyal to his guys.

Do we want to see a repeat of O'Day and Davis when Jones comes up for free agency?

Maybe I'm too loyal to Buck. ? 

I was unaware of his involvement in the Davis deal. I love AJ but wanted to trade him at the deadline if he could have brought back anything decent. I'm in the trade or extend guys a year too early camp. I would have tried to sign Manny for 10 years while he was recovering from knee surgery and I wanted to trade Tillman 4 years ago which would have cost us our playoff run. I can't stand the idea of paying for past production. Loyalty means being there for guys off the field not helping keep them on it longer, imo. These are my considerations from here, but if looking a guy I cared for in the face....we'd still be paying Sam Horn to play first base. I can talk tough about deals here, but I'd never be worse than Buck which is probably why I like him so much. Corn just made me put myself on the couch. What is this, inception ?

 

 

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Cumberbundy Hangout Veteran Council

Cumberbundy

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7 minutes ago, tntoriole said:

See if you can sign Schoop to an extension BEFORE you make the big pitch to Manny this offseason.   And then trade Manny if we cannot sign him.   But I am keeping Schoop either way.   But, in reality, I think Manny is going to go through free agency at this point (Schoop or not, our offer or not).   I advocated for trading him last winter, but, clearly, we did not and have had this pennant winning season..oops, sorry...  I realize second guessing is easy and it would have been very high wire risk taking to do it last winter, but the fact is his value now is much, much less than it would have been then and the return trade value clock continues to just be ticking away.   If it gets to the trade deadline next year, we will be lucky to get any decent prospects in return because teams will know that we are over the proverbial barrel.    

Corn knows we are losing Manny for a draft pick. I got a head start on coping with this reality when he broke it down pre-mlb draft. It's both unbelievable & the most Orioles thing ever. 

 

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Ruzious Hangout Grand Counsel

Ruzious

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1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

I don't have a feeling one way or another.

My guess (and it's just a guess) is that he would rather sign Jones, and I have no problem with him if that is the way he feels, but as a GM, you can't act on feelings like that, and that's why I want him to just be the manager.  That's what he does best - as well as pretty much anyone in the world.  There are different skills and traits that work for a manager but not sessinarily for a GM.  

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El Gordo Hangout Grand Counsel

El Gordo

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4 hours ago, Ruzious said:

My guess (and it's just a guess) is that he would rather sign Jones, and I have no problem with him if that is the way he feels, but as a GM, you can't act on feelings like that, and that's why I want him to just be the manager.  That's what he does best - as well as pretty much anyone in the world.  There are different skills and traits that work for a manager but not sessinarily for a GM.  

Obviously he's not such a great manager if he is so loyal. Or maybe that "loyalty" isn't such a big deal, or maybe it's just patience and wisdom.

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Ruzious Hangout Grand Counsel

Ruzious

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10 hours ago, El Gordo said:

Obviously he's not such a great manager if he is so loyal. Or maybe that "loyalty" isn't such a big deal, or maybe it's just patience and wisdom.

Interesting - what's obvious to you makes no sense to me.  

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