How do you rate the return on the Britton trade?

[Hank Scorpio]

1 hour ago, weams said:

"It's just the way it has to be done." You trade your good guys when you are in the wildcard race and they move you to Portlandia.

I get it... but 2016 ended thanks to Edwin Encarnacion. (And depending on your perspective, Buck.)

I'm not even talking about the trade deadline in 2017.... I'm talking about before spring training, baby. In the cold, cold January breeze. That was prime time. It was clear that offseason that they had no intention of keeping Manny and Britton was a closer coming off of an all time great season. They could have rebuilt the entire system with two deals.

[ScGO's]

2 minutes ago, Todd-O said:

 

Why in the world would anyone trade him when they still are pushing to compete???

 

makes zero sense.   They were still trying to make a run and rightly so.  I’m 1000% glad they stuck with these guys, even while in the WC Chase last year.  

 

 

Although I'm all for pushing out solid relievers before the deeper arbitration years, I agree with you.  Britton seemed like the second coming of Mariano at the time.

[Hank Scorpio]

15 minutes ago, Todd-O said:

 

Why in the world would anyone trade him when they still are pushing to compete???

 

makes zero sense.   They were still trying to make a run and rightly so.  I’m 1000% glad they stuck with these guys, even while in the WC Chase last year.  

 

 

Hey, different strokes for different folks. 

They won 96 games and the division in 2014 without Machado. There are lots of different ways to skin a cat.

[Hank Scorpio]

Going into 2017 the Orioles pitching staff was comprised of two guys who you could have reasonably expected good things from:

1. Gausman

2. Tillman

After that, they had Yovani Gallardo, Ubaldo Jimenez, Tyler Wilson and Mike Wright, I guess. Bundy didn't start any games until around the All Star Break and a lot of people were concerned he would be traded or DFA'd because he HAD to be on the 25 man roster going into the season. Coming off of injury.

 

[JeepTJ12]

I feel like this was a good trade overall.  From the pictures I could find, their mechanics look good except Carroll could lead to injuries in the future.  

[Luke-OH]

I haven’t got to 2018 game video yet, but watching some 2017 AFL footage, Carroll looks like a heck of a second piece. Premium stuff, double plus FB, plus breaking ball, some deception. He’s a better athlete than I’d have guessed too and there may be more command in the future even though he’s not particularly young.

 

[O-Arm36]

I always wondered what we could have gotten for BJ Ryan had we shipped him at the deadline in 2005. Obviously the relief market is different these days, but it would have been nice to have gotten something like this at the time. Pretty pleased with this trade.

[o'sfansince1970]

An effective front office and player development will make this team winners again. No individual player or even 3-4 will turn it around. Some seem to be looking to contend next year and that just isn't  happening. '20 or'21 would be awesome. Those responsible for building recent rosters need to go at season's end. Get back to some bunting, stealing bases and run manufacturing. The defense should improve naturally as the plethora of DHs leave in lieu of guys that can actually play a position. I am pleasantly surprised at the return for Britton. Now it is time to coach them up and trade for even more prospects until they are ready to contend again. As someone else said, I would not mortgage the future to sneak into the play in game ever again. Longer term thinking.

[Bradysburns]

1 hour ago, theocean said:

I don't know if 18 and 19 year old players would be ready by 2020. 

Good point, but they'd be approaching MLB-ready as the window's opening, so to speak. I think 2021 is more realistic for a shot at the playoffs. 2020 would just be when we might make some noise toward being competitive. (Listen to me talking about windows... I don't like talking about windows or rebuilds... but alas, that's where we are.)

[Todd-O]

1 hour ago, Hank Scorpio said:

Hey, different strokes for different folks. 

They won 96 games and the division in 2014 without Machado. There are lots of different ways to skin a cat.

 

Can you tell me one team that traded their lights out all star closer (still under control for more than one year) the season immediately proceeding a playoff run?

[Hank Scorpio]

2 minutes ago, Todd-O said:

 

Can you tell me one team that traded their lights out all star closer (still under control for more than one year) the season immediately preceding a playoff run?

Preceding a playoff run? You mean following an appearance in the play in game, I think.

They didn't make the playoffs in 2017 as far as I know.

[Todd-O]

Yes

[jasmith85]

1 hour ago, Luke-OH said:

I haven’t got to 2018 game video yet, but watching some 2017 AFL footage, Carroll looks like a heck of a second piece. Premium stuff, double plus FB, plus breaking ball, some deception. He’s a better athlete than I’d have guessed too and there may be more command in the future even though he’s not particularly young.

 

Is that Yusniel Diaz the one striking out in the second video? Did you pick that one on purpose? haha

[Hank Scorpio]

Just now, Todd-O said:

Yes

Certainly there is an argument to taking a shot at it... I just didn't see that as the prudent thing to do @ the time.

I'm just saying they had a closer coming off of a career year with 2 years of control left prior to FA and a very talented guy they had absolutely no chance (nor intention apparently) of re-signing going into a year where they had a pitching rotation that was cringeworthy. The Red Sox were clearly superior at this point, so the division wasn't really a consideration. It was one of the two wild cards and you had two other teams in your division with similar records in 2016. 

Call me a pessimist, I guess. I just didn't see the Orioles being the 3rd best team in the division last year. Certainly not this year.

[hoosiers]

10 minutes ago, Todd-O said:

 

Can you tell me one team that traded their lights out all star closer (still under control for more than one year) the season immediately preceding a playoff run?

Who cares?  Do you want to sell off an asset at or near peak value or don't you?  I advocated dealing guys like Davis and Wieters and Hardy around 2012 and 2013 and was mostly mocked - you can't do that, this team can win now, blah, blah, blah.  The Red Sox traded away fan favorite and starting shortstop Nomar Garciaparra in the middle of a pennant race.  It's only a matter of conviction of moving older or less young (and more injury prone) players moving to the wrong side of the salary/production cycle for quality prospects.

The A's constantly cycle and sell off assets for newer, younger ones as do the Rays.  

You know, when you sell off an asset at peak value that you get good, quality value back, right?  Maybe create one hole, but fix another in a better way.  I mean, don't make the trade if the talent received back isn't good enough.  We survived at the closer position just fine after dealing away Jim Johnson.  We will be just fine again in the closer position after dealing ZB.

I post here about once a year regarding the Bedard trade.  Folks love that trade for the excess talent received, but wouldn't do it again if the team was near competing.  I would.  Keep adding to the organizational talent base and good things happen.