Either overhaul the starting pitching development staff, or stop burning high draft picks on pitchers

[Chavez Ravine]

17 minutes ago, OFFNY said:

o

 

Ivan Nova had a couple of good years with the Yankees before bottoming out, and then resurrected his career with the Pirates.

 

o

Stat wise, Nova might be a Gausman comp. They both have been good but inconsistent.

[99ct]

5 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

Good points.

Which is why I am going to advocate for my previous idea of selecting nothing but pitchers.  100% pitchers, every round, 3 years in a row. 40 rounds in the MLB draft x 3 years = 120 new pitchers in our system.  

I'm not sure what we'll do for positional players but we we can have some of the pitchers play in the field when they're not pitching.  They only have to make a few throws a game, it shouldn't be any significant wear and tear.  How many chances does a 3rd baseman get in a game, 6 or 7 max?  No problem.  Just think of it as long toss on an off-day.  Same with the pitchers in the outfield.  And if they pitched the day before they get put at first base where they don't have to make any throws.  

Think how awesome it'll be.  Just pitchers drafted.  Our minor league teams will have never ending bullpens.  We won't have to scramble to find pitching depth because every team from Bowie to Delmarva will have nothing but pitchers.  120 pitchers!  Some will HAVE TO pan out. 

Someone blows out their elbow and needs Tommy John?  No problem!  We got plenty more where that came from!  

How many minor league teams would we need to keep 120 new pitchers busy?

[Ohfan67]

8 minutes ago, 99ct said:

How many minor league teams would we need to keep 120 new pitchers busy?

Moose is saying they will play all the other positions on their off days. 

[Ohfan67]

1 hour ago, Finisher said:

He was excellent that year but it's actually pretty surprising how average he was the rest of his career.

2005 - 2009 ERA+ 108, 120, 146, 116, 151. That's pretty good. Unfortunately for Seattle, those last two years were basically half seasons. He would have had a longer run, but injuries...

[Chavez Ravine]

Teach this thing to bat. Then set up a "pitcher farm" in North Dakota. The pitchers who can get robo-Trout out get sent to Aberdeen.

 

[Hallas]

Gausman has produced more than you would expect, with 2 full years + rest of this season remaining of pre-FA time, from a 75 FV pitching prospect.  I think pitching is really hard over long periods, and coaching pitchers/keeping them healthy is really hard.

The Orioles suck at developing pitchers.  But no one is particularly good at it other than maybe the Braves, and the O’s have had some moderate successes.

[Spy Fox]

A couple years ago things were looking up on this front. In the second half of '16 Gausman was awesome, Bundy held his own in his first half-season of starting, and we didn't know Tillman's reverse-metamorphosis was beginning.

I remember the optimism going into last year that we had just made the playoffs with a pretty poor rotation that figured to get better. 

[ThomasTomasz]

We've already overhauled the development process, but when most 18 year olds don't see the majors until 21-23, you are going to have to wait and see for 3-5 years of those changes are worth it.  

Someone posted an article on here a few weeks ago about how our philosophy on drafting pitching has changed since signing John Wasdin as our director of pitching (or similar title.)  He did a lot of work as a pitching coach in the Athletics organization after wrapping up his career, and learned from one of the best saber metric organizations about drafting and developing pitching.  That is why our last two drafts have been graded pretty well from the start.  And like I said, to see this through, you have to wait 3-5 years before the fruits of this changed philosophy have made it to the majors.  

I do wish we would stop three things: 

1.) Eliminating pitches from being thrown.  Let the pitchers pitch.  Having no one with a cutter is ridiculous.  

2.) Get rid of the cookie cutter minimalist wind-up.  Let a pitcher's windup work for them.  

3.) Stop speeding pitchers up with the lsidestep.  Teach it as a tool, not the primary way to approach things.  Hardly anyone steals anymore, so why put such an emphasis on it.  

[Moose Milligan]

2 hours ago, 99ct said:

How many minor league teams would we need to keep 120 new pitchers busy?

Not sure.  But I'm talking about putting pitchers at positions too so it's probably not as many as you think.

[thezeroes]

The first Orioles draft with the current leadership in the Warehouse was 2011, I believe.  In that June draft 791 Pitchers were drafted.  Of those 791 Pitchers only 152 have played in the MLB Show.  Of those 152 pitchers the highest Accumulated W.A.R. is held by Gerritt Cole at 16.0. 

The following year has 630 pitchers drafted.  Of those 102 have made the Show.  Alex Wood has the highest accumulated W.A.R. at 12.0

In 2013, 653 Drafted Pitchers, 91 made the Show, Sean Manaea has an Accumulated W.A.R. of 7.0

Would these three high WAR Pitchers per draft be considered ACES or Number Ones on their Staffs???

[Il BuonO]

1 hour ago, Hallas said:

Gausman has produced more than you would expect, with 2 full years + rest of this season remaining of pre-FA time, from a 75 FV pitching prospect.  I think pitching is really hard over long periods, and coaching pitchers/keeping them healthy is really hard.

The Orioles suck at developing pitchers.  But no one is particularly good at it other than maybe the Braves, and the O’s have had some moderate successes.

The Rays have developed quite a few.

[weams]

7 hours ago, thezeroes said:

The first Orioles draft with the current leadership in the Warehouse was 2011, I believe.  In that June draft 791 Pitchers were drafted.  Of those 791 Pitchers only 152 have played in the MLB Show.  Of those 152 pitchers the highest Accumulated W.A.R. is held by Gerritt Cole at 16.0. 

The following year has 630 pitchers drafted.  Of those 102 have made the Show.  Alex Wood has the highest accumulated W.A.R. at 12.0

In 2013, 653 Drafted Pitchers, 91 made the Show, Sean Manaea has an Accumulated W.A.R. of 7.0

Would these three high WAR Pitchers per draft be considered ACES or Number Ones on their Staffs???

Great post!

[mdbdotcom]

7 hours ago, thezeroes said:

The first Orioles draft with the current leadership in the Warehouse was 2011, I believe. 

Close. Duquette joined the Orioles in November 2011. His first O's draft was 2012.