Chris Davis 2019 and beyond

[mdbdotcom]

21 minutes ago, wildcard said:

The O's will probably take the field with youth and Davis will still the bench.    That would minimize his impact on the team and on winning or losing.

It also gives the Orioles a 24-man roster. Someone competing for a job should be in that spot.

If he makes an effort to improve and there is some progress, give him a few months to see if he can get better. If he makes no effort, than he's the opposite of a leader and role model and must be cut.

[wildcard]

1 hour ago, mdbdotcom said:

Great management strategy. Fear brings out the best in everyone. 

Not fear.  Respect for management's approach to the game.  Young players trying to make their mark normally have that respect.

[mdbdotcom]

Just now, wildcard said:

Not fear.  Respect for management's approach to the game.  Young players trying to make their mark normally have that respect.

I won't argue the point, but you're wrong. 

[Il BuonO]

3 hours ago, Frobby said:

I don’t give a damn what he is owed!    If it becomes apparent that he’s very, very unlikely to improve, he needs to be cut!    It’s not like he’s a AAAA player.   He’s like an A+ quality player sitting in a big league uniform.    That cannot be tolerated.   Much better to cut him and put some Chris Parmelee level player in his spot, which would be a significant improvement.  

The only reasonable question is how much more time do you give him to show improvement.   I’m pretty much willing to accept any answer through the end of this season, though personally I’d say 2-3 months.    But continuing this level of incompetence into 2020 would be an insult to the game.  

I can scarcely remember you becoming so passionate about any other subjects. And I agree wholeheartedly.

[scOtt]

13 hours ago, wildcard said:

I don't see the O's eating CD's contract any time soon.

Not soon. They'll give him every opportunity to put up some kind of numbers. I'm just not very optimistic.

[Frobby]

3 hours ago, wildcard said:

47-115 is a insult to the game.  An now Elias is likely to trade away the few veterans he has left to obtain prospects for the rebuild.  That probably means lots  more  losing.  If that is not embarrassing to Elias than keeping Davis on the team while they are losing will not be that much of an insult to him or the Orioles or the game.

Has it occurred to you that Davis was a big part of 47-115?    The biggest single contributor to that crapfest?    That in certain respects he set the tone for the whole team?

We should not aspire to go 47-115 again.    And I don’t care that we’re going to be bad either way.   I can’t abide purposely occupying a roster spot with a guy who has shown he’s not even AAAA level unless there’s a reasonable basis to expect that player to improve.    

[wildcard]

10 minutes ago, Il BuonO said:

I can scarcely remember you becoming so passionate about any other subjects. And I agree wholeheartedly.

Yes, he seems pretty passionate about Davis.  I think we are all in for a rough ride.  And Davis may be just part of it.

[Frobby]

1 minute ago, wildcard said:

Yes, he seems pretty passion about Davis.  I think we are all in for a rough ride.  And Davis may be just part of it.

The O’s played .267 baseball when Davis started last year, .371 when he didn’t.   .371 is still terrible, but it’s at least a 60 win pace, as opposed to the 43 win pace when Davis started.    

No, I’m not suggesting the O’s could improve by 17 games just by getting rid of Davis.    But they’d improve a lot, if he continues to play as he did in 2018.

I put that part in bold just to re-emphasize that I’m absolutely open-minded about whether we’ll see improvement in Davis next year.    I just don’t think he gets forever.     He’s declined three seasons in a row and was unconscionably below replacement level last year.    That can’t continue long.   

[wildcard]

33 minutes ago, Frobby said:

The O’s played .267 baseball when Davis started last year, .371 when he didn’t.   .371 is still terrible, but it’s at least a 60 win pace, as opposed to the 43 win pace when Davis started.    

No, I’m not suggesting the O’s could improve by 17 games just by getting rid of Davis.    But they’d improve a lot, if he continues to play as he did in 2018.

I put that part in bold just to re-emphasize that I’m absolutely open-minded about whether we’ll see improvement in Davis next year.    I just don’t think he gets forever.     He’s declined three seasons in a row and was unconscionably below replacement level last year.    That can’t continue long.   

1) I really don't think Elias will just take one shot at fixing Davis.  He will probably try several things over one or more seasons.  So I don't see Elias releasing him in 2 - 3 months.

2)  Out of respect for their father I doubt the Angelos Bros release Davis while their father is still around.  They will be for trying to fix him.

3) There is really no good reason to eat between 40-96m dollar if the team is not a contender.  They can try things to fix him and  decrease his time on the field if that does not work.

4) When the O's are contenders again if Davis is still not being productive that is went the issue with Davis needs to be addressed.  IMO

[Can_of_corn]

9 minutes ago, wildcard said:

1) I really don't think Elias will just take one shot at fixing Davis.  He will probably try several things over one or more seasons.  So I don't see Elias releasing him in 2 - 3 months.

2)  Out of respect for their father I doubt the Angelos Bros release Davis while their father is still around.  They will be for trying to fix him.

3) There is really no good reason to eat between 40-96m dollar if the team is not a contender.  They can try things to fix him and  decrease his time on the field if that does not work.

4) When the O's are contenders again if Davis is still not being productive that is went the issue with Davis needs to be addressed.  IMO

But Elias has total control!!!  What the sons want shouldn't make a difference.

Opening up a slot on the 25 and 40 man rosters is a good reason to cut Davis.  I hope by this time next year the O's have some hard choices on whom to protect on the 40.

[mdbdotcom]

23 minutes ago, wildcard said:

1) I really don't think Elias will just take one shot at fixing Davis.  He will probably try several things over one or more seasons.  So I don't see Elias releasing him in 2 - 3 months.

2)  Out of respect for their father I doubt the Angelos Bros release Davis while their father is still around.  They will be for trying to fix him.

3) There is really no good reason to eat between 40-96m dollar if the team is not a contender.  They can try things to fix him and  decrease his time on the field if that does not work.

4) When the O's are contenders again if Davis is still not being productive that is went the issue with Davis needs to be addressed.  IMO

You can't grow a winning culture with losing players.

[Il BuonO]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

But Elias has total control!!!  What the sons want shouldn't make a difference.

Opening up a slot on the 25 and 40 man rosters is a good reason to cut Davis.  I hope by this time next year the O's have some hard choices on whom to protect on the 40.

This is likely the remaining seed of doubt for most people here.

Elias is likely only as good as the control he really has over all baseball decisions, including onerous contracts. That starts with Davis. If Elias makes a decision (after two to three months) to cut bait on Davis, then I’ll be convinced he has total control.

[weams]

2 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

But Elias has total control!!!  What the sons want shouldn't make a difference.

Opening up a slot on the 25 and 40 man rosters is a good reason to cut Davis.  I hope by this time next year the O's have some hard choices on whom to protect on the 40.

Pucky. When you take over a business and have complete control you can’t necessarily break all the existing property leases.  Nor can you declare bankruptcy without the reconcent of ownership. And their signature. 

[Frobby]

3 hours ago, wildcard said:

1) I really don't think Elias will just take one shot at fixing Davis.  He will probably try several things over one or more seasons.  So I don't see Elias releasing him in 2 - 3 months.

2)  Out of respect for their father I doubt the Angelos Bros release Davis while their father is still around.  They will be for trying to fix him.

3) There is really no good reason to eat between 40-96m dollar if the team is not a contender.  They can try things to fix him and  decrease his time on the field if that does not work.

4) When the O's are contenders again if Davis is still not being productive that is went the issue with Davis needs to be addressed.  IMO

I expect Elias to understand the concept of a sunk cost and to be quite objective in making any determination that Davis’ decline is irreversible.  I don’t want to anticipate whether and when it will occur.    Hopefully Davis improves and the issue becomes moot.    But if he doesn’t, I don’t think Elias will kid himself and stall the inevitable.   We’ll see.   

[weams]

2 hours ago, Il BuonO said:

This is likely the remaining seed of doubt for most people here.

Elias is likely only as good as the control he really has over all baseball decisions, including onerous contracts. That starts with Davis. If Elias makes a decision (after two to three months) to cut bait on Davis, then I’ll be convinced he has total control.

I’ll be convinced if he does it after another season just like this last one.