Roch: "I don't expect Villar back with the O's in 2020."

[Moose Milligan]

2 minutes ago, ThomasTomasz said:

See, the whole Billy Joel concert thing gives a lot of insight into what role, if any, Peter has at this point.  Up and down, he swore for years that the stadium was for baseball only.  The only thing that he bent on that was a visit from the Pope.  He kept turning down offers for concerts over the years.  

So, not even a year after the sons appeared in public after hiring Mike Elias, we have our first concert at OPACY.  I've heard from multiple people that it was so successful, it's happening again, and that they are trying to get at least one, maybe two, scheduled before it gets too cold.  

If the sons decided that they were going to go against dad's wishes on this, they will surely make their own decision about Chris Davis. 

Or maybe big Pete just likes Billy Joel?

[Can_of_corn]

2 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Or maybe big Pete just likes Billy Joel?

Don't go projecting your own preferences onto the owner.

 

This conversation triggered a memory so I figured I'd share.

[Moose Milligan]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

Don't go projecting your own preferences onto the owner.

 

This conversation triggered a memory so I figured I'd share.

Unless it's We Didn't Start The Fire, I'm not into Billy Joel.  

[ThomasTomasz]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

But it is possible that their decision will mirror that of their father.

 

Yes, that's always a possibility.  I've also heard the rumor that Peter's wife was a big reason for the contract, so if that's the case, then yeah, their decision would mirror Peter's.  

However, it's just one of many signs that point to John and Lou being in charge, maybe one of the biggest signs we've had.  

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, Moose Milligan said:

Unless it's We Didn't Start The Fire, I'm not into Billy Joel.  

Your trying to bait me now.

[Moose Milligan]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

Your trying to bait me now.

It's "you're", Philistine.  

[terphoopsfan]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

We don't know the inner dynamics of team payroll.  It is easy for us to say they should spend money just so we have a more enjoyable product to watch next season.

You're right. As of now though they are at $31 million next year according Spotrac. I'm sure there's other $$$ involved so let's say they're somewhere between 50-60 in MLB payroll next year. 

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

It's "you're", Philistine.  

True.

Hey guys get a hold of this.

I was wrong.

[Philip]

27 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I disagree.  I think the one and only reason Davis is on the roster is that ownership refuses to eat the contract.

I will agree that I don't think Elias has had a face to face trying to convince them to release him, I think he knew the situation when he agreed to join the organization.

 I’m sure he knew what was going on, and I’m sure he’s smart enough to know that Davis is toast, but he’s also smart enough to know when to approach the owners. I doubt they are trying to save face, because saving face with this contract is impossible. Plus, they can always wash their hands of it and say, “Dad and Dan did it and they’re both gone.”

We can only speculate as to why this is gone on for so long, but I think Buono and I have reasonable ideas.

[foxfield]

37 minutes ago, Philip said:

The one and only reason Davis is on the roster is the hope that he will return to form. Most of us have already determined that he’s not going to return to form and would just as soon let him go.

The money is spent either way, so I guess the only reason they’re keeping him is because they want to get some value, and right now  they don’t consider his roster spot to be an impediment to that desire. 

If Mike went to the bosses and insisted that he needed the roster spot for player development or a valuation I bet they would let him release Davis, but hasn’t gotten to that point yet.

 

25 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I disagree.  I think the one and only reason Davis is on the roster is that ownership refuses to eat the contract.

I will agree that I don't think Elias has had a face to face trying to convince them to release him, I think he knew the situation when he agreed to join the organization.

I believe both of these positions are largely true and I think they are not as mutually exclusive as you two seem to think.  I think that Elias has not had a conversation about releasing Davis and I think he is on the roster with the hope that every effort is made to return him to some valuable form.  Elias understood the position of ownership when he joined the organization.  And I believe that Elias is, in good faith, trying to make ownerships desire work.  And as long as Davis is not holding up the plan, Elias believes there is no harm in keeping him.  I also believe Elias is nearing a time when that view will change.  We will see...

[foxfield]

21 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

True.

Hey guys get a hold of this.

I was wrong.

 

 

[Philip]

30 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

But it is possible that their decision will mirror that of their father.

 

That’s unlikely. Keeping Davis is a BAD decision. You are suggesting the sons will continue to make the same bad decisions that the father made. Literally every move we’ve seen since they took over has been correcting bad decisions that the father made, so your possibility Is increasingly unlikely. It remains possible, yes, as does everything, but unlikely, and more so with every new decision. There is a very slight possibility that they are not releasing Davis because of respect to dad, but one thing I’ve learned about lawyers is that they don’t really care very much about the feelings of the people around them. Their goal is to represent the interests of their client, and that doesn’t change if they themselves are the client.

[Can_of_corn]

4 minutes ago, foxfield said:

 

I believe both of these positions are largely true and I think they are not as mutually exclusive as you two seem to think.  I think that Elias has not had a conversation about releasing Davis and I think he is on the roster with the hope that every effort is made to return him to some valuable form.  Elias understood the position of ownership when he joined the organization.  And I believe that Elias is, in good faith, trying to make ownerships desire work.  And as long as Davis is not holding up the plan, Elias believes there is no harm in keeping him.  I also believe Elias is nearing a time when that view will change.  We will see...

Sure, the main difference is I don't think Elias is under any illusions that they will get value from Davis at some point.

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, Philip said:

That’s unlikely. Keeping Davis is a BAD decision. You are suggesting the sons will continue to make the same bad decisions that the father made. Literally every move we’ve seen since they took over has been correcting bad decisions that the father made, so your possibility Is increasingly unlikely. It remains possible, yes, as does everything, but unlikely, and more so with every new decision. There is a very slight possibility that they are not releasing Davis because of respect to dad, but one thing I’ve learned about lawyers is that they don’t really care very much about the feelings of the people around them. Their goal is to represent the interests of their client, and that doesn’t change if they themselves are the client.

It's a bad decision to keep him now.  Even if him being on the 25 and 40 man rosters only makes a small difference it's still not optimal for him to be here. 

[foxfield]

3 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Sure, the main difference is I don't think Elias is under any illusions that they will get value from Davis at some point.

Yep, I agree, I think coming from the outside it was pretty apparent but he is giving it his full effort.  And I think when the time comes, that will be part of his assessment to ownership that it is time to move on.