wildcard Posted August 6, 2019 Author Share Posted August 6, 2019 43 minutes ago, Frobby said: Villar has now played just over one full season (166 games) with the O’s: .264/.332/.423, 102 runs scored, 23 HR, 75 RBI, 45 SB with 9 CS. That adds up to 3.2 rWAR. He’s played every single game since he arrived in Baltimore. I’d happily take that from my 2B year in and year out. The thing that has been against Villar being a Oriole next season is his possible 7m salary. That doesn't seem to match up with Elias' rebuild strategy. But the rebuild seem to be speeding up. The O's offense is becoming major league quality. Its the pitching that is lacking now. If the projection of at least some of the Bowie crowd of pitchers becomes July of next season instead of 2021, then maybe Elias will be willing to spend on Villar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke-OH Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 3 minutes ago, wildbillhiccup said: I sure hope so. I'm just not sure they'll be a market for him. Gennett and Kendrick are both FAs this season. I'm guessing most GMs would prioritize both of them over Villar, unless they're desperate for SBs. I'm not so sure about that, Kendrick is going to be 37 next year and hasn't gotten 350 PA since 2016. His defense is worse than Villar and he doesn't hold up to everyday play. Gennett is coming off a serious injury and what looks like a lost year. Both are better hitters than Villar, but both also carry risk that he doesn't and Villar is the youngest of the three. He's also the only one who can handle SS reasonably. He won't have much surplus value at his arbitration cost, but enough to get a modest return. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interloper Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 Eh, I didn't think they would tender him but now I do. Pretty easy to tender him a contract and trade him mid-season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Can_of_corn Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 1 minute ago, interloper said: Eh, I didn't think they would tender him but now I do. Pretty easy to tender him a contract and trade him mid-season. ? Brewers had a hard time finding a taker in 2018 and Elias couldn't find a taker in 2019. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke-OH Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 Just now, Can_of_corn said: ? Brewers had a hard time finding a taker in 2018 and Elias couldn't find a taker in 2019. Yeah, it's gotta be an offseason trade, it's hard to get anything for an average-ish position player at the deadline. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildcard Posted August 6, 2019 Author Share Posted August 6, 2019 1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said: ? Brewers had a hard time finding a taker in 2018 and Elias couldn't find a taker in 2019. I agree. Seems like the O's only tender him if they want to keep him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interloper Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 3 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said: ? Brewers had a hard time finding a taker in 2018 and Elias couldn't find a taker in 2019. Yeah maybe. I think we all agree it was pretty surprising the lack of infielders that were needed at the deadline this year. I don't expect that to repeat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Just Regular Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 On 8/4/2019 at 10:36 AM, RZNJ said: Unless I'm mistaken, Karns st 800K was last off seasons' largest expenditure. 3M is possible but I think Elias would prefer to fill in with more Alberto/Ruiz/Rondon types. That sounds right, and 2019 Karns IMO offered a better possibility of ROI if he had a Best Case kind of season than 2020 Villar would. I think we're seeing 2019 Villar having a Mid-Best Case kind of season without establishing any market value. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildbillhiccup Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 18 minutes ago, Luke-OH said: I'm not so sure about that, Kendrick is going to be 37 next year and hasn't gotten 350 PA since 2016. His defense is worse than Villar and he doesn't hold up to everyday play. Gennett is coming off a serious injury and what looks like a lost year. Both are better hitters than Villar, but both also carry risk that he doesn't and Villar is the youngest of the three. He's also the only one who can handle SS reasonably. He won't have much surplus value at his arbitration cost, but enough to get a modest return. I don't think any sane team would give Villar regular starts at SS and he's only a year younger than Gennett. I also think teams will be willing to give Gennett a free pass for this season. He had two very good seasons prior. You have to imagine he'll get a DJ LeMahieu / Daniel Murphy type contract. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildbillhiccup Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 14 minutes ago, interloper said: Yeah maybe. I think we all agree it was pretty surprising the lack of infielders that were needed at the deadline this year. I don't expect that to repeat. So it's the lack of infielders needed and not just the lack of suitors for Villar in particular? I'm not sure that logic holds up. Gennett was traded...Sogard was traded... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interloper Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 19 minutes ago, wildcard said: I agree. Seems like the O's only tender him if they want to keep him. Well and honestly, they may? He's not going to bring much in return anyway, so maybe a $7 mil shortstop isn't so bad of a thing to just have on the team, even if it's just for a year and he walks after. The O's really don't have any decent chips other than Mancini and Givens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
interloper Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 1 minute ago, wildbillhiccup said: So it's the lack of infielders needed and not just the lack of suitors for Villar in particular? I'm not sure that logic holds up. Gennett was traded...Sogard was traded... I dunno man. It really doesn't matter much. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildbillhiccup Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 29 minutes ago, wildcard said: The thing that has been against Villar being a Oriole next season is his possible 7m salary. That doesn't seem to match up with Elias' rebuild strategy. But the rebuild seem to be speeding up. The O's offense is becoming major league quality. Its the pitching that is lacking now. If the projection of at least some of the Bowie crowd of pitchers becomes July of next season instead of 2021, then maybe Elias will be willing to spend on Villar. There are literally no pieces on the active roster that will be part of the rebuilt team. They're all just band-aids / place holders for the the younger players. So I'm not sure I'd use the term "speeding up". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Luke-OH Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 Just now, wildbillhiccup said: I don't think any sane team would give Villar regular starts at SS and he's only a year younger than Gennett. I also think teams will be willing to give Gennett a free pass for this season. He had two very good seasons prior. You have to imagine he'll get a DJ LeMahieu / Daniel Murphy type contract. No, I don't think he'd get regular time at SS, but the flexibility has value. So then it's a choice of paying 2/24M for Gennett's age 30, 31 seasons or 1/7M and a middling prospect for Villar's age 29 season. Villar has been basically a league average regular or better 3 of the last 4 years. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Can_of_corn Posted August 6, 2019 Share Posted August 6, 2019 21 minutes ago, interloper said: Yeah maybe. I think we all agree it was pretty surprising the lack of infielders that were needed at the deadline this year. I don't expect that to repeat. I don't want to bet 3M on that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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