Why did Davis go after Hyde? He was not happy.

[Hallas]

22 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

I can't believe some of you are still as heavily invested in this a day later.  No punches thrown, no dirty laundry aired out in the media.  Just constant speculation but it's clear that the O's are gonna be tightlipped about this and not give any of us anything to chew on.

Won't stop us from trying though.  

It's a nice change of pace.  As opposed to asking ourselves questions like, "Why are we so invested in this sh**show of a major league baseball team?" or "Why does every pitcher on our staff give up about 19 home runs every time they're on the mound?"  When you ask those questions every day it gets old.

[mdbdotcom]

I'm hoping Davis now demands a trade. That would be pure comedy gold, and the perfect topper for this incident.

[24fps]

28 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Sadly, in today’s society, that’s not necessarily an exaggeration.   

If you're suggesting that I might have phrased my post a little differently given recent events, point taken.

[TonySoprano]

2 hours ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Have fun defending Davis now. 

Roch Kubatko

 

@masnRoch

·

7m

 

OK, here's what I've heard about the Hyde/Davis argument. We'll learn more tomorrow: Davis was frustrated by the inning, threw something in dugout, it hit Hyde, Hyde said something, you saw the rest. No punishment is expected. Had nothing to do with scooped ball, pop up, etc

Maybe Hyde reminded him he was the only thing Davis managed to hit all night. 

[LookinUp]

25 minutes ago, Frobby said:

5.  With all that said, Davis is not a major league quality baseball player anymore.   ... any long-term repercussions of this in the clubhouse (which I doubt), 

The first part is the only reason this is being talked about. Any long term repercussions could get worse, but make no mistake that every eye in that clubhouse was already on Davis just about every day before this. That's probably why it happened. Now it's likely to get worse, which I'm ok with if it means we're more likely to cut him.

[Ruzious]

24 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Here’s my current take:

1.    Based on Roch’s latest report, it seems Davis is more at fault for starting the incident than some thought.    But I’m still reluctant to assign blame for the matter escalating.    

2.    I wouldn’t call Davis’ approach to Hyde an “attack.”    For all we know, he was just going to get in Hyde’s face to make his point.   When other players stepped in he retreated to the bench pretty quickly.   So let’s not treat this like it’s Papelbon choking Harper.    

3.   Hyde took the correct approach in the post game presser and deescalated the situation.   I didn’t see anything happen in the dugout that warrants a suspension .   It requires a discussion man-to-man, and that’s what will happen.  

4.  Frankly, I think the whole incident has been a bit overblown. In sports, sometimes things get overheated.    Then you calm down and move on.   

5.  With all that said, Davis is not a major league quality baseball player anymore.    He should have been cut for quality-related reasons already.   So, if there’s any long-term repercussions of this in the clubhouse (which I doubt), that’s just one more reason to jettison a player who should have been jettisoned by now anyway.   And there’s no reason for me to engage in character assassination of Davis to reach that conclusion.   

I think it's been... underblown - except perhaps in this thread.  I wouldn't have even heard about it if it wasn't for this thread.  Basically, he's likely not getting any official punishment even though he's the worst player on the worst team in the majors, threw his helmet in the dugout - which then hit the manager (the chances of it hitting someone were pretty high - so this ain't a oops bad luck situation), the manager said something, and instead of Davis replying with an apology - he yelled at the manager and made a move as if he was going to rush him.  

 

I'm sure a lot of worse things happen that we never even hear about, but that doesn't change the fact that it's not an excusable situation.   

[tntoriole]

1 hour ago, theocean said:

I'm sorry that having the audacity to have an opinion that differs with yours is complete garbage.

I think it's important to realize that Brandon Hyde isn't a broadcaster like Jim Hunter, where it is refreshing to hear an announcer or commentator speak to the truth and not sugar-coat things. Brandon Hyde is the manager. His job is to be a leader and make sure the O's win games. If you're looking for the post-game presser to be a source of valuable insight, I think that is a terribly misguided expectation.

We don't need Brandon Hyde to tell us how bad this team is. You're right, everything Hyde has said is correct. But, there's plenty of people on ESPN, MASN, NBC, FOX, and tons of baseball websites to tell us that. What we need is Brandon Hyde to be a manager who keeps the clubhouse together and playing the best that they can. He isn't a commentator. He isn't the Orioles PR team. He's the manager.

Roch has now stated he thinks Davis threw something in frustration, it hit Hyde's foot possibly, Hyde said something that wasn't appreciated, and it set Davis off. Why is a manager doing that? Why is a manager saying to the press that the guys on his team are not good enough? He can do whatever he wants behind closed doors - but not publicly. Whether you agree with that or not - modern baseball players do not like that. At all. Take one look at the Red Sox/Dennis Eckersley situation and you'll know that modern baseball players have certain expectations. Hell, Joe Girardi was a great manager and he got shown the door in New York because the clubhouse wasn't with him.

Simply put, sure - if you're someone doesn't sugar-coat things, that's great. I completely understand. But, me personally, I care about what is effective. And we've seen on countless occasions that modern day baseball players have no patience for some of the things Hyde has been doing lately. We can shout about typical old-man-millenials-are-crybabies takes all day - but it doesn't matter. What matters is effective, and that's not trying to pick a fight with your first baseman. That's not talking to the press about how your pitching staff sucks.

Hey, Chris Davis appears to have been in the wrong and needs to take responsibility.  But there is also the straw that breaks the camel’s back...Chris Davis has no business being on a major league roster, but he is now only because of his contract.  And now he acts out too.  I wouldn’t be surprised if it comes out after he is gone that he has been grousing behind the scenes in the clubhouse  about not being played every day given his ego and Hyde has not yet thrown him under the bus in public but maybe an attitude led to some animosity between them.  Hyde sees him do something stupid, like throwing something in the dugout and likely tells him to just knock it off and Davis then goes ballistic.  If I am Elias and the Angelos brothers, I am DFAing Chris Davis today and sending a message that what counts in this organization is performance and behavior, not entitlement and stupidity.

And if Hyde upsets our current pitchers by accurately assessing their performances, then good!  They can either pitch better or they can be cut too, which is likely going to be the case anyway.   I wouldn’t be worried too much if I am Hyde about whether these pitchers need their egos massaged or what the effects on the long term relationship might be with our current pitchers, because very few of them will likely even be on this club two years from now because they CAN’T PITCH. 

[LookinUp]

3 minutes ago, tntoriole said:

Hey, Chris Davis appears to have been in the wrong and needs to take responsibility.  But there is also the straw that breaks the camel’s back...Chris Davis has no business being on a major league roster, but he is now only because of his contract.  And now he acts out too.  I wouldn’t be surprised if it comes out after he is gone that he has been grousing behind the scenes in the clubhouse  about not being played every day given his ego and Hyde has not yet thrown him under the bus in public but maybe an attitude led to some animosity between them.  Hyde sees him do something stupid, like throwing something in the dugout and likely tells him to just knock it off and Davis then goes ballistic.  If I am Elias and the Angelos brothers, I am DFAing Chris Davis today and sending a message that what counts in this organization is performance and behavior, not entitlement and stupidity.

And if Hyde upsets our current pitchers by accurately assessing their performances, then good!  They can either pitch better or they can be cut too, which is likely going to be the case anyway.   I wouldn’t be worried too much if I am Hyde about whether these pitchers need their egos massaged or what the effects on the long term relationship might be with our current pitchers, because very few of them will likely even be on this club two years from now because they CAN’T PITCH. 

I essentially agree with your whole post, but the only question I have w/r/t Hyde isn't whether his actions today will have long term repercussions, the question is whether the statement on pitchers is likely reflective of his actions more broadly, which would carry with him as new players arrive.

With that said, I've read this thread and tend to agree that even his comments about the pitchers are way over blown in this thread, so it's probably much ado about nothing as far as that goes. I really don't want an organization of sensitive sallys who cannot take criticism. 

[wildbillhiccup]

Do any of us think this would have played out the same way if Brett Gardner had hit Aaron Boone with his helmet (instead of himself) earlier in the year? I sure don't. If I had hit Hyde with a helmet I would have felt embarrassed not confrontational...no matter what he said. Yes we're all probably making this out to be more than it was, but it really feels like this whole painful situation with Davis and his contract coming to a head. Remember it's usually a straw that breaks the camel's back not a 500 lbs weight. 

[BRobinsonfan]

1 hour ago, theocean said:

That's what he's supposed to do, right? I think every manager in MLB would be expected to cover for their players. It's why they run out on the field when their player starts arguing with an umpire, for instance.

I'm not saying that Hyde is some out-of-control manager, but recently it seems like he's letting his personal frustration get to him. I know we all don't like Davis very much and are looking for reasons to get rid of Davis, but Hyde's the leader of the team. He's supposed to be the example.

What specifically do you mean?  Are there other instances you're thinking of? Is it just the comment about the pitching? Earl Weaver was a pretty successful leader by any measure but no one would accuse  him of having a good check on his temper.  

[mdbdotcom]

I'm guessing that if any of the other players on the team had thrown a helmet in frustration and hit the manager with it by accident, he would have started apologizing before the manager had a chance to say anything.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

 

[Frobby]

6 minutes ago, Ruzious said:

Basically, he's likely not getting any official punishment even though he's the worst player on the worst team in the majors, threw his helmet in the dugout - which then hit the manager (the chances of it hitting someone were pretty high - so this ain't a oops bad luck situation), the manager said something, and instead of Davis replying with an apology - he yelled at the manager and made a move as if he was going to rush him.  

 

5 minutes ago, tntoriole said:

Chris Davis has no business being on a major league roster, but he is now only because of his contract.  And now he acts out too.  I wouldn’t be surprised if it comes out after he is gone that he has been grousing behind the scenes in the clubhouse  about not being played every day given his ego and Hyde has not yet thrown him under the bus in public but maybe an attitude led to some animosity between them.  Hyde sees him do something stupid, like throwing something in the dugout and likely tells him to just knock it off and Davis then goes ballistic.  If I am Elias and the Angelos brothers, I am DFAing Chris Davis today and sending a message that what counts in this organization is performance and behavior, not entitlement and stupidity.

I guess it’s the lawyer in me, but I want more than Roch’s skimpy tweet and partial video clips before assessing exactly what happened here and calling this a DFA-level offense.    They can DFA Davis any time for his lousy play so far as I’m concerned, but I’m not sure yet if this episode really adds anything much to the equation.  

[tntoriole]

1 minute ago, wildbillhiccup said:

Do any of us think this would have played out the same way if Brett Gardner had hit Aaron Boone with his helmet (instead of himself) earlier in the year? I sure don't. If I had hit Hyde with a helmet I would have felt embarrassed not confrontational...no matter what he said. Yes we're all probably making this out to be more than it was, but it really feels like this whole painful situation with Davis and his contract coming to a head. Remember it's usually a straw that breaks the camel's back not a 500 lbs weight. 

There is definitely some previous animosity likely coming out in this altercation....and most of it I believe comes from Davis and his own unhappiness.  He needs to go. 

[Can_of_corn]

Did anyone post this?

Evidently Smash Mouth has an opinion.

Someone needs to shut up and sing All Star.