Is Hyde Managing for the #1 Pick or to be fired?

[eddie83]

2 minutes ago, atomic said:

Yet most of the people supporting the plan don't go to games.  

They don’t have to be mutually exclusive. 

[atomic]

13 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

There you go. Case closed. 

What you want is not want Elias is trying to do. 

You can’t rip Elias for not executing a plan he isn’t trying to accomplish in the first place. 

Why not? If his plan was to win 67 games and spend $20 million dollars you could rip the plan if you wanted to.   

 

[DrungoHazewood]

12 minutes ago, atomic said:

Yet most of the people supporting the plan don't go to games.  

I'm assuming you've commissioned some polls in the stands and aren't just stating suppositions as fact to support your case?

Edit: actually, what you're saying is probably literally  the case since only a relatively small fraction of any team's fans actually go to games.  Most Cardinals fans who support their management don't go to games, since they draw 3M but may have 10 or 20 million people who self-identify as fans.

[eddie83]

3 minutes ago, atomic said:

Why not? If his plan was to win 67 games and spend $20 million dollars you could rip the plan if you wanted to.   

 

You know what I am saying. 

You keep piling on knowing full well everything he does you have been against in the first place. He can’t win with you. It is a never ending argument.  

[atomic]

12 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I'm assuming you've commissioned some polls in the stands and aren't just stating suppositions as fact to support your case?

Just reading the posts on here.  Seems other than a few members most of the people on here don't go to games anymore.  And a lot don't even watch the games on TV.

Also the Astro's narrative isn't even true.  The rebuild was mostly about acquiring expensive veterans and the players they already had on the team.  The Astros have a $200 million dollar payroll and acquired a  couple of pitchers who will be making over $30 million dollars a year. 

[7Mo]

3 minutes ago, DrungoHazewood said:

I'm assuming you've commissioned some polls in the stands and aren't just stating suppositions as fact to support your case?

 

Any post that incorporates "suppositions" is a good post.

[atomic]

18 minutes ago, eddie83 said:

You know what I am saying. 

You keep piling on knowing full well everything he does you have been against in the first place. He can’t win with you. It is a never ending argument.  

He can win by making an effort by trying to improve the team in the off-season. That means shoring up the bullpen and acquiring some low dollar starters. Bring up Mountcastle, Hayes and Diaz and see if we can win some games. 

 

[Tony-OH]

17 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

I can live with 3-4 years, wish it was quicker, but I am praying its not another 14 year period repeating itself. Its already been 2 too many, and some would say 3 too many.

Well, to atomic's glee, Elias will be long gone if we are starting a new 14-year period. 

The new infrastructure, technology/analytics, and commitment to international scouting suggests if anything, this organization is finally being prepared properly for a sustained run of success.

[foxfield]

31 minutes ago, atomic said:

1.3 million fans this year. Probably less than a million next year.  I don't think anyone likes his plan.

I think this is a phrase that is not only wrong, but is misleading. I think most people understand the plan and understands that a full rebuild is necessary.  It is in fact dangerous to tear it down, because it does not guarantee the rebuild is successful.  However, the statement is misleading because as you continually do with your retorts of people blindly following Elias, it presupposes that everyone agrees blindly with everything. It can't be both ways.  Everyone blindly supports or nobody likes his plan.  The reality is that almost everyone understands the plan.  Judging it will require time.  Your rationale as usual is questionable....and

5 minutes ago, atomic said:

I would have enjoyed the season more if they did.  

THIS is why you receive so much flack.  You are clearly advocating for the same type of management that provided hope and failure for 14 years.  Elias is doing something different and you are judging him for not doing what you want.  That is intellectually dishonest.  If you were being fair, you would criticize ownership for advocating a rebuild.  As always, you could be right and Elias will fail.  But it would not be for failing to do what you want.  He is doing exactly what he said and presumably exactly what ownership asked for.....there will be much to debate over the next few years and I think most here enjoy debating.  But lets stay on the same field.  Trying to say this is the worst team in the NFL is just air.  (I know you didn't say NFL)

[Redskins Rick]

4 minutes ago, foxfield said:

I think this is a phrase that is not only wrong, but is misleading. I think most people understand the plan and understands that a full rebuild is necessary.  It is in fact dangerous to tear it down, because it does not guarantee the rebuild is successful.  However, the statement is misleading because as you continually do with your retorts of people blindly following Elias, it presupposes that everyone agrees blindly with everything. It can't be both ways.  Everyone blindly supports or nobody likes his plan.  The reality is that almost everyone understands the plan.  Judging it will require time.  Your rationale as usual is questionable....and

THIS is why you receive so much flack.  You are clearly advocating for the same type of management that provided hope and failure for 14 years.  Elias is doing something different and you are judging him for not doing what you want.  That is intellectually dishonest.  If you were being fair, you would criticize ownership for advocating a rebuild.  As always, you could be right and Elias will fail.  But it would not be for failing to do what you want.  He is doing exactly what he said and presumably exactly what ownership asked for.....there will be much to debate over the next few years and I think most here enjoy debating.  But lets stay on the same field.  Trying to say this is the worst team in the NFL is just air.  (I know you didn't say NFL)

dont feed the trolls, there is nothing you can say, will get him to change his mind.

 

[jtschrei]

I will not rest easy until the Orioles have secured the #2 pick. 

As far as I am concerned, it was a job well done by our atrocious bullpen!

At this point in the season, there is no good reason that we should have any other priority than getting the #2 pick. 

[atomic]

13 minutes ago, foxfield said:

I think this is a phrase that is not only wrong, but is misleading. I think most people understand the plan and understands that a full rebuild is necessary.  It is in fact dangerous to tear it down, because it does not guarantee the rebuild is successful.  However, the statement is misleading because as you continually do with your retorts of people blindly following Elias, it presupposes that everyone agrees blindly with everything. It can't be both ways.  Everyone blindly supports or nobody likes his plan.  The reality is that almost everyone understands the plan.  Judging it will require time.  Your rationale as usual is questionable....and

THIS is why you receive so much flack.  You are clearly advocating for the same type of management that provided hope and failure for 14 years.  Elias is doing something different and you are judging him for not doing what you want.  That is intellectually dishonest.  If you were being fair, you would criticize ownership for advocating a rebuild.  As always, you could be right and Elias will fail.  But it would not be for failing to do what you want.  He is doing exactly what he said and presumably exactly what ownership asked for.....there will be much to debate over the next few years and I think most here enjoy debating.  But lets stay on the same field.  Trying to say this is the worst team in the NFL is just air.  (I know you didn't say NFL)

I don't have a problem with a total rebuild. I  have a problem with the failure to fill the team with major league quality players.  And I have said plenty of things about ownership.   I didn't expect Elias to create a winning team or even finish out of last place in the division.  I did want to see some sort of effort though..  It is the lack of effort to do anything about the results on the field that bothers me. 

I mean if I start seeing anything positive that he is doing I will be positive about it. He said he would sign a bunch of guys from the Dominican.  Vast Majority  of the teams international slots remain unspent.  The team hasn't broken ground on a modern facility in the Dominican or announced their intentions to do so. 

Really I would like someone to visit our facility in the Dominican and report back.  

 

[atomic]

13 minutes ago, Redskins Rick said:

dont feed the trolls, there is nothing you can say, will get him to change his mind.

 

By that measure everyone on here is trolls. Because I can't get you to change your mind about the path the team is going down that makes you a troll?

[NCRaven]

3 minutes ago, jtschrei said:

I will not rest easy until the Orioles have secured the #2 pick. 

As far as I am concerned, it was a job well done by our atrocious bullpen!

At this point in the season, there is no good reason that we should have any other priority than getting the #2 pick. 

Castro and Givens want #1.

[jtschrei]

Just now, NCRaven said:

Castro and Givens want #1.

LOL. My guys. Their biggest contribution to the team this year has been draft positioning!