Hyde postgame presser today

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, survivedc said:

It’s legitimate to say that some of the expectations have been derailed by injuries to Hays, Santander Stewart and Diaz to a lesser degree. 
Nobody was expecting to win, but there was a thought that the offense could be good with some of that group being involved. With none of them on the field together it’s hard to have anything on ML team to be excited about.

Right, and that is also true of the other teams.

You don't expect to go into the season and not have injuries.  Paritcialy when you have guys like...Hays, Santander, Stewart and Diaz that have histories of injuries.

[forphase1]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

Right, and that is also true of the other teams.

You don't expect to go into the season and not have injuries.  Paritcialy when you have guys like...Hays, Santander, Stewart and Diaz that have histories of injuries.

Sure, but most other teams have some serviceable guys they can plug into those holes either from AAA or their MLB bench.  While we are apparently getting some decent depth at the A and AA level, to say we have a bunch of talent in AAA to replace when our MLB starters goes down isn't accurate.  I think our future is bright, but it appears that next year is the year our youth movement seems to start providing some good dividends as outside of a few (Mullins, Means) those that are closest to MLB ready are either underperforming (most of the pitchers, Mountcastle, etc) or can't stay healthy.  I was hoping this was the year some of the youth would take a step forward and give us a more watchable team, but with the shutdown last year and the poor performances so far, it certainly doesn't look like that's the case.  And with the changes in rosters and the  old style September callups being changed, I don't know how much of the exciting younger talent we will see this year.  But I certainly agree with some others that it's past time to cut bait with some dead weight (both catchers especially) and bring up some kids...if I'm going to watch bad baseball I'd rather it be for someone that has a SLIM chance of one day being a good player for us than Severino and Sisco who we know what we've got...a bunch of nothing.

[Pickles]

The weakness of this team is pretty obvious: 

The starting pitching.  A team with Harvey, Lopez, Zimmerman, Kremer is just not going to be able to string wins together.  At least as they're currently performing.

The offense is bad.  It isn't embarrassing.  I'm disappointed in Mountcastle, but not shocked.  I thought he'd struggle mightily at some point with that approach.  He'll adjust, and get a plan, or he'll be a fringe major leaguer.  He's still very young, with a great pedigree, and we stink, so there's no reason not to run him out there every day at this point.  I guess I can say Sisco has been atrocious, but how much were any of us expecting anything from him?  Same of Ruiz. They're 13th in the AL in RS, and if they had six more they'd be 9th.  I don't think that range there is unexpected.

The bullpen is bad.  But it isn't embarrassing.  I do worry about it getting exposed as the season goes on.

The defense is bad.  It isn't embarrassing.  And when we put out best players out there, I'm not even sure I'd agree it is bad.

What makes this team bad is what makes plenty of teams bad and we have seen it all before:

Negative starting pitchers, and negative regular players.  You simply can't have 25% of your roster bringing negative value and be competitive.  Or even not embarrassing.  

This team will show improvement when we have more than one dependable starter.  We don't need to be the 95 Braves, but we need 5 guys who give us a chance every night.  You can win the whole thing without a "true" ace.  But when 4/5ths of your starting rotation is below replacement, you're well on your way to being embarrassing.

The same is true on the positional side.  You simply can't have 3-4 black holes in your lineup.

I don't want to go down the road again, but it isn't so easy as just bringing in different guys from the outside the organization.  Unless you're willing to start spending on a different class of money or prospect.  And frankly, the very fact that we need like 10 new players to really make us competitive, suggests doing that is a desperate grasp likely to fail.

This team will get better when they get consistent starting pitching.  That's the biggest difference-maker.  And the best hope of that lies in AA right now.

The longest term worry for me- besides the perpetual one of we need more pitching forever and always- is what are we going to do about the infield?  That's the long-term black hole in talent.

 

 

 

 

Starting Pitching- dont need aces, look at 2014 or even 2016 need solid production from the rotation spots

Replacement players- can't have negative guy. certainly can't have multiple of them starting.

That is largely what duquette cleaned up.

[accinfo]

Rio Ruiz, Steve Wilkerson, Pedro Severino, Sisco, McKenna, Franco, Pat Valaka, Steve Wilkerson, and DJ Stewart are just not everyday major league players.  These guys have gotten too many at bats.  Some because of injuries but no one can win with all those bad players in a major league lineup.  DJ Stewart deserved a long look because of the production he showed in a small spurt last year.  However I have seen enough.  You could justify one of the catchers lack of offense if they were decent defensively but neither is.  I still have a ton of hope for Ryan Mountcastle but he swings at too many bad pitches.  He deserves to play everyday because there is no one at Norfolk with any upside to take his spot while he worked on things at AAA.  Maybe if Diaz got healthy he could come up and DH and you could justify sending Mountcastle down to try to get it together.  Austin Hayes is a good all around player when he is healthy.  Him being healthy is just a problem.  Some of the injuries in the past you could say were freakish, bad luck, but now it is one hamstring early in the season and now the other hamstring.  That just is very concerning.  When he is healthy he needs to play.   You can say Santander and Mancini are everyday good ballplayers on most teams.  Galvis has been a pleasant surprise.  Mullins has certainly been good so far but you can't yet say he is a proven reliable everyday major league player yet.  However he should play everyday for the rest of the season.  If Rutschman gets to the point in July that he is hitting well I have changed my mind that they should bringing him because he can at least play the position defensively.  It also gives the fans something to get excited about.  You then promote a Michael Bauman and maybe a DL Hall at the end of the year and I think it will give some hope.  Maybe even a start by Grayson Rodriquez.  

 

 

 

 

[Can_of_corn]

6 hours ago, forphase1 said:

Sure, but most other teams have some serviceable guys they can plug into those holes either from AAA or their MLB bench.  While we are apparently getting some decent depth at the A and AA level, to say we have a bunch of talent in AAA to replace when our MLB starters goes down isn't accurate.  I think our future is bright, but it appears that next year is the year our youth movement seems to start providing some good dividends as outside of a few (Mullins, Means) those that are closest to MLB ready are either underperforming (most of the pitchers, Mountcastle, etc) or can't stay healthy.  I was hoping this was the year some of the youth would take a step forward and give us a more watchable team, but with the shutdown last year and the poor performances so far, it certainly doesn't look like that's the case.  And with the changes in rosters and the  old style September callups being changed, I don't know how much of the exciting younger talent we will see this year.  But I certainly agree with some others that it's past time to cut bait with some dead weight (both catchers especially) and bring up some kids...if I'm going to watch bad baseball I'd rather it be for someone that has a SLIM chance of one day being a good player for us than Severino and Sisco who we know what we've got...a bunch of nothing.

Whose fault is it that the O's don't have serviceable folks to plug in?

We still blaming Dan for that?

[slakattack]

10 hours ago, Tony-OH said:

At some point he's going to have to actually care about the major league product and soon because the fan base has withered to the point that fans just don't care or discuss the Orioles outside of the die-hards. And it's hard to be a die-hard when your team has become irrelevant.

 

This. The big difference for me between, say, the 1988 team and any one of the last four teams is that back then God-awful play was an aberration for a proud and storied franchise and we expected it to end or dramatically improve in the off season. Now it seems to be what the potential fan-base and the rest of the baseball world just expects from the Baltimore organization.

[Camden_yardbird]

13 hours ago, Tony-OH said:

The lack of development of the players we hoped would be the beginning of the resurgence has really been the major downer.

I feel bad for Hyde because he does seem to be a good baseball man, but it's hard to know how much say he has in roles of his players and pitchers.

All we know is this team is a disaster and although we all signed up for a rebuild, it's been pretty ugly and we're now in the 3rd season of Elias tenure and the major league team is the worse in baseball still. Not increasingly getting better, but sadly uncompetitive.

Last year, although a shortened season, we saw some promise in Means, Mountcastle, Scott, Santander and Hays for the future. Hays has been hurt twice, and outside of Means, the others have all under performed with Santander being hurt as well.

Regardless of whether the organization turns into a perennial winner or not, they will always have the stain of being an embarrassment to baseball for at least 4 season straight. Grant it one of those seasons was not under Elias' tenure, but the fact he decided to go into this season with such a poor squad shows he really doesn't care about putting even a decent product on the field while he rebuilds from the inside. 

At some point he's going to have to actually care about the major league product and soon because the fan base has withered to the point that fans just don't care or discuss the Orioles outside of the die-hards. And it's hard to be a die-hard when your team has become irrelevant.

 

Finally.  

Before this season I said this.  I said we need to worry about Elias.  Look, I get some of what we have done at the minor league level is good.  But for the Orioles to eventually compete against the Yankees and Boston and Tampa the GM has to be good on many different levels from drafting, player development, call up preparation, roster competitiveness evaluation, skill evaluation, waiver claims, trades, free agent acquisition, international player acquisition, choice of coaching staff and managet.  They can't underperform significantly at any of these.  How many people look at what Elias has done in 2.5 years and realistically think he is that guy?

[MDtransplant757]

So we all signed up for a tank, they're still tanking because almost all of the progress Elias has drafted is still in DelMarVa or Aberdeen (Sans Rutschman) and we're complaining that the MLB team is terrible when that's not the point of focus ATM anyway? Look at the guys in the minors on all levels. Even the guys Duquette drafted are doing fantastic. This team will be good sooner than later. Everything is going to be a year behind because COVID killed the MiLB season. Mountcastle looks lost but there is slight improvement, and that will come more as the season goes on. Everything on Savant looks horrendous now but I think it gets better; mainly because his April was just that awful. We've seen he can hit AAA pitching, now he needs to keep improving. Make this a season of growth for him, and if it's the same song and dance next year, then we'll have reason to scream. Dean Kermer needed a full year in Norfolk, and I'd argue he still does. They rushed him, and that's not on Kermer at all. Mancini has come roaring back, Mullins looks amazing, and while Hays and Santander have been hurt, they have looked great when on the field. Does it suck that this team isn't winning right now? Absolutely. However, the silver lining is that from Bowie down the future is bright. Grayson Rodriguez (Who just got moved up to AA) and DL Hall look like Legit TOR starters. Henderson and Westburg, while getting lucky if we look at BABIP, are setting A ball on fire. Diaz needs a full season in Norfolk, as really do Bauuman, Lowther and Bradish. We will need some patience and probably a coaching change or two here on the ML Level to get everything really going. The astros rebuild was in a similar spot in 2014, when they had guys like Altuve up but really no one else. We're still going to have some high draft picks that Elias has hit on. Relax, trust the plan. These guys built a contender in Houston. These things take time. I get the fan apathy at this point, but in a couple years, we'll be there. Just like Houston is

[forphase1]

7 hours ago, Can_of_corn said:

Whose fault is it that the O's don't have serviceable folks to plug in?

We still blaming Dan for that?

There is plenty of blame to go around.  Yes, some is on Dan as if he'd done a better job then our high minor leagues would be more full of ready to be plugged into the MLB level.  And some is on Elias, as he's often chosen to pick younger players in trades, kids who were 2-3 years away or longer instead of those who were already close to the majors.  That may have been the right decisions to make, but it certainly hasn't helped to keep the AAA team to talent we can bring up as needed.  Elias is certainly partly to blame for the lack of quality in the MLB and AAA level, but that doesn't mean it was the wrong decision to make either.  I'm not sure I'd trade having a slightly better MLB and AAA resources if that meant we didn't have as much talent in the AA and A teams right now that should be making strides over the next year or two.  It certainly makes watching the MLB team painful right now, even if it was the right way to go about things.

[Aristotelian]

1 hour ago, MDtransplant757 said:

So we all signed up for a tank, they're still tanking because almost all of the progress Elias has drafted is still in DelMarVa or Aberdeen (Sans Rutschman) and we're complaining that the MLB team is terrible when that's not the point of focus ATM anyway? Look at the guys in the minors on all levels. Even the guys Duquette drafted are doing fantastic. This team will be good sooner than later. Everything is going to be a year behind because COVID killed the MiLB season. Mountcastle looks lost but there is slight improvement, and that will come more as the season goes on. Everything on Savant looks horrendous now but I think it gets better; mainly because his April was just that awful. We've seen he can hit AAA pitching, now he needs to keep improving. Make this a season of growth for him, and if it's the same song and dance next year, then we'll have reason to scream. Dean Kermer needed a full year in Norfolk, and I'd argue he still does. They rushed him, and that's not on Kermer at all. Mancini has come roaring back, Mullins looks amazing, and while Hays and Santander have been hurt, they have looked great when on the field. Does it suck that this team isn't winning right now? Absolutely. However, the silver lining is that from Bowie down the future is bright. Grayson Rodriguez (Who just got moved up to AA) and DL Hall look like Legit TOR starters. Henderson and Westburg, while getting lucky if we look at BABIP, are setting A ball on fire. Diaz needs a full season in Norfolk, as really do Bauuman, Lowther and Bradish. We will need some patience and probably a coaching change or two here on the ML Level to get everything really going. The astros rebuild was in a similar spot in 2014, when they had guys like Altuve up but really no one else. We're still going to have some high draft picks that Elias has hit on. Relax, trust the plan. These guys built a contender in Houston. These things take time. I get the fan apathy at this point, but in a couple years, we'll be there. Just like Houston is

Great post. Yeah, 12 in a row (or is it 13?) is terrible but look at the system as a whole and you can see a strategy taking shape. Sure, Mountcastle, Hays, Zimmerman, and Kremer are disappointing but we knew none of them were guaranteed to be stars, and all of them have time and potential to develop. Means is a massive success and Mullins is turning into at least a minor one. Santander is solid. The system was regarded as top 5 going into the season and some are now saying Grayson is the top pitching prospect in the game. I could see us moving up even higher next year. Vavra, Bradish, and Smith are looking like very good pickups to go with the draft picks and you don't get those guys without feeling some short term pain. We are finally acquiring international players. I can't remember a time in my lifetime that the minors have all been clicking like this. It will take some time to translate into MLB wins but I much prefer this to filling holes with Vlad Guerrero/Sammy Sosa/Melvin Mora types.

[joelala]

51 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Great post. Yeah, 12 in a row (or is it 13?) is terrible but look at the system as a whole and you can see a strategy taking shape. Sure, Mountcastle, Hays, Zimmerman, and Kremer are disappointing but we knew none of them were guaranteed to be stars, and all of them have time and potential to develop. Means is a massive success and Mullins is turning into at least a minor one. Santander is solid. The system was regarded as top 5 going into the season and some are now saying Grayson is the top pitching prospect in the game. I could see us moving up even higher next year. Vavra, Bradish, and Smith are looking like very good pickups to go with the draft picks and you don't get those guys without feeling some short term pain. We are finally acquiring international players. I can't remember a time in my lifetime that the minors have all been clicking like this. It will take some time to translate into MLB wins but I much prefer this to filling holes with Vlad Guerrero/Sammy Sosa/Melvin Mora types.

Agree with pretty much all of this but Mora was way better than geriatric Vlad and Sammy. Look at his numbers.  Melvin was legit. 

[Aristotelian]

2 minutes ago, joelala said:

Agree with pretty much all of this but Mora was way better than geriatric Vlad and Sammy. Look at his numbers.  Melvin was legit. 

Lol, absolutely a better player, but better off doing the rebuild first then adding a player like him.

[Uli2001]

The Orioles should change their name to the Cicadas, they make an appearance every 17 years.

[bpilktree]

We had a below average team that was young last year with a few surprises.  They had a very strong bullpen and about 5 guys that Hyde could count on.  Guys like Scott, Armstrong, Fry Armstrong, Givens, Tate  and Valdez all had ERA’s under 3.  This year he can’t count on anyone except Fry.  The starting pitching doesn’t pitch well or go deep in games which was the same last year but shortened season and guys you can count on to get outs out of pen helped.  
 

Last years team also had Cobb, Iglesias, Alberto, and Nunez.  Now those guys were not great but were professional players that you knew what to expect from them.  but we had to shave payroll and let them all walk or traded them for young players in minors.  This team can not hit with runners on to save our life the last two weeks and when it happens to young players they tense up and try harder which doesn’t work.  Trey who has been great was doing that to start the year.  Last year Iglesias hit .421 with runners in scoring position which picked up guys last year.  Galvis who has been decent hitter is hitting under .150.  Mountcastle hit .343 last year in those situations this year .156.  
 

 

[Camden_yardbird]

4 hours ago, MDtransplant757 said:

So we all signed up for a tank, they're still tanking because almost all of the progress Elias has drafted is still in DelMarVa or Aberdeen (Sans Rutschman) and we're complaining that the MLB team is terrible when that's not the point of focus ATM anyway? Look at the guys in the minors on all levels. Even the guys Duquette drafted are doing fantastic. This team will be good sooner than later. Everything is going to be a year behind because COVID killed the MiLB season. Mountcastle looks lost but there is slight improvement, and that will come more as the season goes on. Everything on Savant looks horrendous now but I think it gets better; mainly because his April was just that awful. We've seen he can hit AAA pitching, now he needs to keep improving. Make this a season of growth for him, and if it's the same song and dance next year, then we'll have reason to scream. Dean Kermer needed a full year in Norfolk, and I'd argue he still does. They rushed him, and that's not on Kermer at all. Mancini has come roaring back, Mullins looks amazing, and while Hays and Santander have been hurt, they have looked great when on the field. Does it suck that this team isn't winning right now? Absolutely. However, the silver lining is that from Bowie down the future is bright. Grayson Rodriguez (Who just got moved up to AA) and DL Hall look like Legit TOR starters. Henderson and Westburg, while getting lucky if we look at BABIP, are setting A ball on fire. Diaz needs a full season in Norfolk, as really do Bauuman, Lowther and Bradish. We will need some patience and probably a coaching change or two here on the ML Level to get everything really going. The astros rebuild was in a similar spot in 2014, when they had guys like Altuve up but really no one else. We're still going to have some high draft picks that Elias has hit on. Relax, trust the plan. These guys built a contender in Houston. These things take time. I get the fan apathy at this point, but in a couple years, we'll be there. Just like Houston is

Lunhow built a good team in Houston, and they are going to have to be much better here than they were in Houston.  I don't foresee the current ownership ever devoting the same level of resources or payroll.

Not to mention that in 2017 - 2019 when Houston won the division three years in a row the AL west had a total of three other teams over .500 (okaland in 18 and 19, Seattle in 18).  The Orioles will never have that luxury in the AL East.