Elias prioritizes player development over winning in the majors

[Can_of_corn]

5 minutes ago, Going Underground said:

When Max Scherzer was 24, he was in his first full year in the rotation of the Arizona Diamondbacks. He lost more than he won. He gave up nine runs in one start and eight in two others. He flashed the brilliance to come. He didn’t bring it consistently

 

 

And was his psyche crushed?

I also wouldn't say someone that had a 108 ERA+, a FIP of 3.87, and a K rate of 9.2/9 in 2009 was getting crushed. 

[Can_of_corn]

32 minutes ago, Jammer7 said:

Let them build innings in a more controllable environment, at least that is the theory. It’s about their long term health and success. I guess we’ll see if they are right. I think they are. 

No we won't.

We will see what will happen but we won't see what would have happened.

 

[waroriole]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

No we won't.

We will see what will happen but we won't see what would have happened.

 

I guess that makes it a great position to take on a message board. You’ll never be wrong. 

[Can_of_corn]

9 minutes ago, waroriole said:

I guess that makes it a great position to take on a message board. You’ll never be wrong. 

And neither will anyone else.

Or did you miss that part?

[Frobby]

47 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I don't think there is anything that a guy like DL or Grayson can learn at AAA that they can't learn in the majors.  I think adversity is a better teacher than dominance.

 

I also think the reaching benchmarks is code for gaming service time.  Lots of TOR guys skip entire levels.

Jose Fernandez for instance was a TOR guy, a HS guy.

What benchmarks did he reach?

I’ve looked at successful major league pitchers to see if they skipped AAA or not.   It’s a mixed bag; the majority had at least some AAA time, but a healthy number did not.  

To me, the recent development of using the major league ball in AAA is a big reason to send pitchers there first.  Let them adjust to throwing the major league ball, see if they have hiccups, and when those hiccups are over, promote them.   Bradish has mentioned in several interviews that he had trouble adjusting to the ball, and we’ve certainly seen quite a few other O’s pitchers who statistically took a step back in AAA over the last few years, whether due to the ball or just the better competition.  
 

[waroriole]

2 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

And neither will anyone else.

Or did you miss that part?

I know it sounds unorthodox, but if a pitcher would just throw with his feet while doing a cartwheel they’d be unstoppable. I’m willing to die on this hill. Unfortunately, we’ll never see what would happen. 

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, waroriole said:

I know it sounds unorthodox, but if a pitcher would just throw with his feet while doing a cartwheel they’d be unstoppable. I’m willing to die on this hill. Unfortunately, we’ll never see what would happen. 

Shame they have rules to stop that type of move.  So we know it won't work in the majors.

 

[Can_of_corn]

6 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I’ve looked at successful major league pitchers to see if they skipped AAA or not.   It’s a mixed bag; the majority had at least some AAA time, but a healthy number did not.  

To me, the recent development of using the major league ball in AAA is a big reason to send pitchers there first.  Let them adjust to throwing the major league ball, see if they have hiccups, and when those hiccups are over, promote them.   Bradish has mentioned in several interviews that he had trouble adjusting to the ball, and we’ve certainly seen quite a few other O’s pitchers who statistically took a step back in AAA over the last few years, whether due to the ball or just the better competition.  
 

And how would it hurt the 2022 O's to have them do their adjusting in the majors?

They going to sabotage the O's chances at the third wildcard?

[waroriole]

1 minute ago, Can_of_corn said:

Shame they have rules to stop that type of move.  So we know it won't work in the majors.

 

My solution to that is to use the money we’re saving on payroll to hire lobbyists to get rule changes at MLB. A few wine and dines and we’ll get the rules we need to take advantage of cartwheel foot pitching. I’m seriously questioning Elias’ strategy for not doing this. 

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, waroriole said:

My solution to that is to use the money we’re saving on payroll to hire lobbyists to get rule changes at MLB. A few wine and dines and we’ll get the rules we need to take advantage of cartwheel foot pitching. I’m seriously questioning Elias’ strategy for not doing this. 

Ownership probably won't OK the cost.

[waroriole]

5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Ownership probably won't OK the cost.

I guess you missed the part where I have lobbyists. 

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, waroriole said:

I guess you missed the part where I have lobbyists. 

I was talking about the Orioles ownership.

[waroriole]

5 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I was talking about the Orioles ownership.

Yeah that’s the lobbyist’s first assignment. The Angeli

[Barnaby Graves]

8 hours ago, Moose Milligan said:

Everything has to break right.

Everything has to break right and the farm system’s results at the ML level have been choppy at best, and the pitching mostly a disaster.

[yark14]

1 hour ago, Can_of_corn said:

Why is Grayson not ready?

Other than service time considerations.

Same for Hall really.  If this was a contending club I could easily see Hall put into the bullpen with the idea of having him switch to starting in 2023.

It has everything to do with aligning their prime years to be while they are still under arbritration.  The closer to their mid-20s a player can get before being debuted, you can keep them cheap until around 30.  At that point they are likely at the downturn of their prime and not worth a risky and expensive contract.  That is Elias' entire strategy when it comes to managing top prospects.  Adley should have made his debut in 2020.