The warning signs are there for the reading

[Tony-OH]

30 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

The crying and whining!    I have a right not to like it.  What a bunch of depressing whiners.   He mentioned 14 years of losing baseball and taleked about how he feels history repeating itself.   Now, you started a thread that just eggs on the whiners.   You are entitled to your red flags.   I am entitled to see how the off-season plays out.   In the meantime I think I should be able to comment on the whiners.

 

 

 

You are, but what you don't have the right is to belittle or attack others who don't agree with your assessment. Feel free to disagree, that's what this board is for, but you are the only one in this thread attacking while doing so. 

I know you know better and I know you can do better while disagreeing. You seem to take it personally if someone has a differing opinion. It's ok, it happens. 

 

[interloper]

It will be interesting to track how the Orioles operate going forward compared to the Astros rebuild path. After the Astros' first winning season in their rebuild, they too did not make any big splashes in the off-season. It was the following off-season they unleashed the payroll floodgates, I believe.

So technically, we're still on the Astros path, but it's hard to believe the Angelos family will give Elias the same freedom Crane gave Luhnow.

Edited December 13, 2022 by interloper

[RZNJ]

39 minutes ago, owknows said:

Where were you yesterday?

Exactly.  You were ganged up on yesterday and called absurd.  

[Can_of_corn]

3 minutes ago, interloper said:

It will be interesting to track how the Orioles operate going forward compared to the Astros rebuild path. After the Astros' first winning season in their rebuild, they too did not make any big splashes in the off-season. It was the following off-season they unleashed the payroll floodgates, I believe.

So technically, we're still on the Astros path, but it's hard to believe the Angelos family will give Elias the same freedom Crane gave Luhnow.

I think it might be the Pirates path.

[LookinUp]

31 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Yep.

I'd also like to point out that whining about whining is still whining.  

What is whining about whining about whining? 

That's winning, my friends.

[Tony-OH]

7 minutes ago, interloper said:

It will be interesting to track how the Orioles operate going forward compared to the Astros rebuild path. After the Astros' first winning season in their rebuild, they too did not make any big splashes in the off-season. It was the following off-season they unleashed the payroll floodgates, I believe.

So technically, we're still on the Astros path, but it's hard to believe the Angelos family will give Elias the same freedom Crane gave Luhnow.

This is my main concern with the plan. What no one can argue is that Elias has built a great farm system and improved our development and international presence. 

The problem with the Astros model though is that talent must eventually be offset by impact players, especially starting pitchers, and we've been given no actions that indicate the Angelos family will allow to happen with their current legal (Lou/MASN, etc) issues ongoing.

I'm not saying it can't happen, I'm just saying no actions so far have shown it will happen.

[DrinkinWithFermi]

10 minutes ago, RZNJ said:

Exactly.  You were ganged up on yesterday and called absurd.  

I mean, claiming that you want the Orioles to operate like the Rays but even cheaper is pretty absurd. 

[Tony-OH]

52 minutes ago, owknows said:

Where were you yesterday?

Sorry, I can't see everything. I thought you were doing a great job of giving your opinion without attacking. I didn't see anyone attack you back, but maybe I missed it. Sometimes I have to actually do my real job and it takes me away from the board for hours at a time. that leads me to getting behind and don't read everything.

Either way, I have a pretty good feel for what's disagreeing and what's attacking, and so far I've only seen one person so far unable to discuss without attacking.

[interloper]

13 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think it might be the Pirates path.

I think Elias really wants it to be the Rays path. Sounds like he recognizes it can't really be the Astros path in his comments (paraphrasing: "it's hard in the AL East but we've seen smaller market teams have success if they're smart", etc). The Astros certainly can't be described as small market at this point. 

But... ya know, we have to at least get the payroll up to the Rays level at some point for us to get on that path. The Rays aren't afraid to hand out some larger deals when it makes sense. 

Edited December 13, 2022 by interloper

[Tony-OH]

4 minutes ago, interloper said:

I think Elias really wants it to be the Rays path. Sounds like he recognizes it can't really be the Astros path in his comments (paraphrasing: "it's hard in the AL East but we've seen smaller market teams have success if they're smart", etc). The Astros certainly can't be described as small market at this point. 

But... ya know, we have to at least get the payroll up to the Rays level at some point for us to get on that path. The Rays aren't afraid to hand out some larger deals when it makes sense. 

I definitely think the Rays model may be how Elias ultimately decides he must operate if he's not going to be given much of a budget.

I hope people realize that means Rutschman and Gunnar will be traded by year 4 or 5 if that's the case.

Personally, while I can appreciate how the Rays keep themselves relevant, they've never won a WS with this model and I do think the lack of identity with their players is a problem for some fans.

I don't think the Orioles need to be run like that and with the right ownership support, they shouldn't. 

 

[owknows]

5 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

Sorry, I can't see everything. I thought you were doing a great job of giving your opinion without attacking. I didn't see anyone attack you back, but maybe I missed it. Sometimes I have to actually do my real job and it takes me away from the board for hours at a time. that leads me to getting behind and don't read everything.

Either way, I have a pretty good feel for what's disagreeing and what's attacking, and so far I've only seen one person so far unable to discuss without attacking.

I was just griping about spite mass downrating of unrelated posts yesterday.

Mostly a tongue in cheek comment on my part.

Not really worth looking into.

[RZNJ]

26 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

You are, but what you don't have the right is to belittle or attack others who don't agree with your assessment. Feel free to disagree, that's what this board is for, but you are the only one in this thread attacking while doing so. 

I know you know better and I know you can do better while disagreeing. You seem to take it personally if someone has a differing opinion. It's ok, it happens. 

 

Attack?    I attacked his post.  Attacking him would be Yardball calling Owknows the most absurd poster ever or HakunaSakata downvoting him 3 times in one thread.   Feels like you have a dog in this fight.   I’ll take a self imposed time out now.

[Can_of_corn]

9 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

I definitely think the Rays model may be how Elias ultimately decides he must operate if he's not going to be given much of a budget.

I hope people realize that means Rutschman and Gunnar will be traded by year 4 or 5 if that's the case.

Personally, while I can appreciate how the Rays keep themselves relevant, they've never won a WS with this model and I do think the lack of identity with their players is a problem for some fans.

I don't think the Orioles need to be run like that and with the right ownership support, they shouldn't. 

 

If Rutschman is only here for four years they can't afford to punt on year two.

[Tony-OH]

9 minutes ago, owknows said:

I was just griping about spite mass downrating of unrelated posts yesterday.

Mostly a tongue in cheek comment on my part.

Not really worth looking into.

I saw that downvoting by a newer member on you.  I actually went and downgraded the amount of rep new members can give or take away before they reach limited posting members stage and they lose the ability all together until they become a plus member.

[Tony-OH]

4 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

If Rutschman is only here for four years they can't afford to punt on year two.

Truth. The problem is, Elias may not have been given the budget to do so. If that ends up the truth, they will need to hope for a lot of young players to really step up, especially Grayson and Hall in the rotation.