Westburg's Value at the trade dealine

[Daddy-O's]

Is Westburg's trade value higher at the July trade deadline if he is still at triple A putting up numbers and playing 3rd, short and second (not at the same time).  He would still have all the hype of a top 100 prospect and would draw interest from teams that need a third baseman, teams that need a shortstop and also teams needing  a second baseman.  Once he gets here and gets tagged as a second baseman and goes thru the struggles of an adjustment period, does he lose some of the market and luster of potential.  I could be wrong and just trying to wrap my head around the Frazier acquisition. 

[sevastras]

If he gets to the big leagues and hits, it won’t matter where he plays he will be more valuable then in the minors. 

[UMDTerrapins]

Maybe, but Frazier wasn’t acquired so that we could park Westburg at AAA…so we could maximize his trade value. To me, the only concern with bringing in Frazier is that managers skew to have loyalty to veterans. So he’s a good on-paper pickup today, but on the field during the season I’m concerned he’s going to slow the development of the middle infield guys who are pretty central to our future. It’s more likely Westburg is an important piece with the O’s than he is trade bait. In my opinion, Frazier is more likely to be dealt at the deadline than Westburg. I think his signing was a stopgap solution until Westburg/Ortiz/Norby/Vavra are ready. It would be unusual to pre-determine which prospect other teams will want at the deadline. 

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, UMDTerrapins said:

Maybe, but Frazier wasn’t acquired so that we could park Westburg at AAA…so we could maximize his trade value. To me, the only concern with bringing in Frazier is that managers skew to have loyalty to veterans. So he’s a good on-paper pickup today, but on the field during the season I’m concerned he’s going to slow the development of the middle infield guys who are pretty central to our future. It’s more likely Westburg is an important piece with the O’s than he is trade bait. In my opinion, Frazier is more likely to be dealt at the deadline than Westburg. I think his signing was a stopgap solution until Westburg/Ortiz/Norby/Vavra are ready. It would be unusual to pre-determine which prospect other teams will want at the deadline. 

I think Frazier was acquired because Elias wanted another LHB that could play second and spell guys in the outfield.

[Daddy-O's]

1 minute ago, UMDTerrapins said:

Maybe, but Frazier wasn’t acquired so that we could park Westburg at AAA…so we could maximize his trade value. To me, the only concern with bringing in Frazier is that managers skew to have loyalty to veterans. So he’s a good on-paper pickup today, but on the field during the season I’m concerned he’s going to slow the development of the middle infield guys who are pretty central to our future. It’s more likely Westburg is an important piece with the O’s than he is trade bait. In my opinion, Frazier is more likely to be dealt at the deadline than Westburg. I think his signing was a stopgap solution until Westburg/Ortiz/Norby/Vavra are ready. It would be unusual to pre-determine which prospect other teams will want at the deadline. 

Fraizer is not going to get you a top of the rotation starting pitcher at the deadline, a top one hundred prospect might.  If he can play third, short or second there would be more teams interested.  After this winter they may have decided the free agent market is not the place to get a top of the rotation starter.  They should look at their glut of young middle infielders and decide which one they can market and get the most for, I doubt they keep them all.

[Aristotelian]

This could be a very interesting trade deadline. We could make some big moves whether we are in a contending or retooling scenario. There could be a lot of interest in Westburg, Norby, and Ortiz. Although I like them all I don't see any of them as essential to the long term plan which is really all about Gunnar and Holliday. We could easily promote one of them to replace a struggling Frazier and still have assets to spare. I am not suggesting we trade all of them but I would certainly move one or two of them for that last missing piece.

 

[wildcard]

4 minutes ago, Daddy-O's said:

Fraizer is not going to get you a top of the rotation starting pitcher at the deadline, a top one hundred prospect might.  If he can play third, short or second there would be more teams interested.  After this winter they may have decided the free agent market is not the place to get a top of the rotation starter.  They should look at their glut of young middle infielders and decide which one they can market and get the most for, I doubt they keep them all.

If the O's have GRod, Bradish, Means, Hall and Kremer the O's may not need to trade a top hundred prospect for a starter.

I would rather see Gibson, Frazier and maybe Santander considered for trade at the deadline if that makes sense at that time.

 

[DirtyBird]

2 minutes ago, wildcard said:

If the O's have GRod, Bradish, Means, Hall and Kremer the O's may not need to trade a top hundred prospect for a starter.

 

You left out Irvin

[Aristotelian]

16 minutes ago, UMDTerrapins said:

Maybe, but Frazier wasn’t acquired so that we could park Westburg at AAA…so we could maximize his trade value. To me, the only concern with bringing in Frazier is that managers skew to have loyalty to veterans. So he’s a good on-paper pickup today, but on the field during the season I’m concerned he’s going to slow the development of the middle infield guys who are pretty central to our future. It’s more likely Westburg is an important piece with the O’s than he is trade bait. In my opinion, Frazier is more likely to be dealt at the deadline than Westburg. I think his signing was a stopgap solution until Westburg/Ortiz/Norby/Vavra are ready. It would be unusual to pre-determine which prospect other teams will want at the deadline. 

Why couldn't Vavra be the stopgap? He is as ready as he is going to be. I am really struggling to see the sense of $8m for Frazier. He is a better version of Odor but we have much less need for Odor/Frazier than we did last year. 

Anyway, I think/hope you are on the right track. Frazier gives us the ability to bring up the prospects when Elias determines they are ready. Elias must anticipate trading some number of Hays/Urias/Santander/Mateo/Vavra so at that point Frazier will still have a role even if one of Westburg/Norby/Ortiz plays their way onto the roster. $8M is a lot to pay for that but we have seen Elias overpay for a specific need so it is possible Frazier is not locked in as the 2B for the full season despite his paycheck.

[Frobby]

21 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think Frazier was acquired because Elias wanted another LHB that could play second and spell guys in the outfield.

Sometimes the simplest answer is also the correct one.  

[Aristotelian]

32 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I think Frazier was acquired because Elias wanted another LHB that could play second and spell guys in the outfield.

Clearly. The question is why he thinks we need that when we have Vavra and three near MLB ready prospects to do the same thing cheaper.

[maybenxtyr]

I know you have to trade something to get something but Westburg is a guy that I would rather see in Baltimore than another location.

 

There was a time when I thought he was the better prospect over Gunnar. Obviously Gunnar went off, but that doesn't change the fact that Westburg has a lot of talent.

[HakunaSakata]

In a perfect world, we'll be trading one of Frazier, Ortiz or Mateo to make room for Westburg at the trade deadline. 

[Tony-OH]

40 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

You left out Irvin

I imagine that was done on purpose. I'm fairly certain Wildcard believes Irvin will certainly implode by then and will be out of the rotation.

[Can_of_corn]

27 minutes ago, Aristotelian said:

Clearly. The question is why he thinks we need that when we have Vavra and three near MLB ready prospects to do the same thing cheaper.

The prospects aren't left handed batters.

I don't think Vavra has enough glove for Elias.