Angelos Claims He's Not Selling

[Sports Guy]

42 minutes ago, Pickles said:

Ok, by that standard every single owner of every franchise is meddling when they set a budget.

Well but if they are setting a budget that makes sense. The current Os budget doesn’t make sense and it’s obvious that he is also isn’t allowing much, if any, multi year spending either. 
 

[Tony-OH]

44 minutes ago, Frobby said:

I think that’s a real misrepresentation of what he said.  He basically said he leaves the running of the baseball team to the baseball people, and his job is to focus on broader issues like the private-public partnership between the Orioles, the Ravens and the City.   There was plenty of harmless BS in the interview but I was happy with the big picture items: the team isn’t going anywhere and the baseball people are running the baseball team.  

We get, you're an Angelos guy, but I think you are short selling what he actually said. He's always allowed Elias to run things which is good, but he absolutely is a part of setting the budget. No owners gives a blank check to their GMs. Now, can Elias spend within that budget, sure.

[Pickles]

9 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

If Angelos came up and kicked you in the nads, I bet you'd thank him for not cutting them off.  

If you really think owners allow GMs to decide their budgets then you are delusional. 

Very clearly looks like he's give them X to spend but they get to determine how to spend X.  Which is exactly what we've been asking them to do for decades now.

[Pickles]

8 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Well but if they are setting a budget that makes sense. The current Os budget doesn’t make sense and it’s obvious that he is also isn’t allowing much, if any, multi year spending either. 
 

I don't know if it "makes sense," but I will say we fans are very unlucky that the ownership group of our team relies on that team to generate an income stream.  That's very unfortunate for us.

[Sports Guy]

12 minutes ago, Pickles said:

I don't know if it "makes sense," but I will say we fans are very unlucky that the ownership group of our team relies on that team to generate an income stream.  That's very unfortunate for us.

Acting like they don’t have an income stream is idiotic. They have plenty of revenue and income coming in.  They saved a lot of money during the pandemic, Disney money, tv/radio, tickets, etc…

They don’t use MASN, that’s the actual issue.  We all know this.

[Pickles]

2 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Acting like they don’t have an income stream is idiotic. They have plenty of revenue and income coming in.  They saved a lot of money during the pandemic, Disney money, tv/radio, tickets, etc…

They don’t use MASN, that’s the actual issue.  We all know this.

I'm talking about an income stream outside of the baseball team.  The only way the family has to make money is through the team.  That isn't the case for many (most?) franchise owners who are independently wealthy and/or own successful businesses.  The source of the Angelos' family wealth is the law firm; apparently, the firm is dead.

They need to operate the team to turn a profit annually.  Most teams don't operate like that.

[Moose Milligan]

Watching the interview, I don't have a problem with anything he said.  Rambles a little bit, a little longwinded.  

Doubling down on showing the financials, which will be interesting.  

Maybe JA is on his way to being more accessible to the media.  Maybe not.  But this this by far and away the most accessible that an Angelos has been in 20+ years.  

 

 

 

[jabba72]

7 minutes ago, Pickles said:

I'm talking about an income stream outside of the baseball team.  The only way the family has to make money is through the team.  That isn't the case for many (most?) franchise owners who are independently wealthy and/or own successful businesses.  The source of the Angelos' family wealth is the law firm; apparently, the firm is dead.

They need to operate the team to turn a profit annually.  Most teams don't operate like that.

Which I think is probably the worst outcome possible for the fans. The O's bottom line is his only revenue stream. Im sure he wants it cheap. 

[Pickles]

1 minute ago, jabba72 said:

Which I think is probably the worst outcome possible for the fans. The O's bottom line is his only revenue stream. Im sure he wants it cheap. 

Agreed.  As I said, it's very unfortunate for us as fans.

But does he not have a right to operate his business in such a way that allows him to maintain ownership of it?

[Jagwar]

I'm too lazy to look up direct quotes, but I thought Angelos has communicated in the recent past that the O's would increase payroll if fans returned to the ballpark (and downtown generally). Seems to be to be a bass-ackward way of running a baseball team. It should be... invest dollars in a better on-field product, and fans will come.  

[Frobby]

48 minutes ago, Tony-OH said:

We get, you're an Angelos guy, but I think you are short selling what he actually said. He's always allowed Elias to run things which is good, but he absolutely is a part of setting the budget. No owners gives a blank check to their GMs. Now, can Elias spend within that budget, sure.

I don’t doubt at all that Angelos plays a role in setting the budget.   I do want to point out that the overall budget is one thing, the payroll is another.  It’s the biggest single budget item but far from the only one.  We know that in the high-payroll Duquette years, the team was skimping on other things like international spending, infrastructure etc.  So it could well be that Angelos tells Elias how much he can spend, and then it’s up to Elias whether to spend it on payroll or other things.  

By the way, I don’t consider myself to be an Angelos guy.   I just don’t see the need to draw a negative inference every time he opens his mouth.  We’ll see how the team operates the next 2-3 years.  It will tell us a lot about how the team will operate in the long term. 
 

[Frobby]

1 minute ago, Jagwar said:

I'm too lazy to look up direct quotes, but I thought Angelos has communicated in the recent past that the O's would increase payroll if fans returned to the ballpark (and downtown generally). Seems to be to be a bass-ackward way of running a baseball team. It should be... invest dollars in a better on-field product, and fans will come.  

Kind of a chicken and egg thing, no?   It will be interesting to see what attendance is like this year, after the Orioles’ unexpectedly good 2022 season.  

[Too Tall]

 

My interpretation of what JA said, is he relies on Elias and Co. to tell him what they project they need going into a budgetary year. I did not get the impression he arbitrarily sets a budgetary figure void of their imput. I believe, most companies/organizations are run that way. Elias has never inticated he's been short changed. Hasn't he said when he needs the resources, he's been told they will be there? Got a feeling we will know if that is not true. 

Look forward to the budgetary press conference. And, if I am seen as a JA Apologist, allow me to take this time to apologize for his personnal trainer and dress code. 

[Going Underground]

7 minutes ago, Jagwar said:

I'm too lazy to look up direct quotes, but I thought Angelos has communicated in the recent past that the O's would increase payroll if fans returned to the ballpark (and downtown generally). Seems to be to be a bass-ackward way of running a baseball team. It should be... invest dollars in a better on-field product, and fans will come.  

Older quote from John A  Elias said the other part about fans returning. I will try and find it.

I think what Mike said is right on,” Angelos said. “We have always felt that a rebuild requires you to take it down, and you have a long view, that you’re going to reinvest early and middle and often, and that’s going to give you fewer valleys and a whole lot more peaks. We were very successful for five years [from 2012 to 2016], but we had a drop-off. This is designed to take us out five, seven, 10 [years], more like a Tampa Bay kind of an approach, except with bigger payrolls.”

 

 

 

The Orioles’ young core will help payroll ‘increase steadily.’ It won’t justify a meager mark in 2023. | ANALYSIS – Baltimore Sun
https://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/orioles/bs-sp-orioles-payroll-young-core-analysis-20221214-nnpcashs7nhnnli3ooek2hfoqa-story.html

[Going Underground]

1 minute ago, Going Underground said:

Older quote from John A  Elias said the other part about fans returning. I will try and find it.

I think what Mike said is right on,” Angelos said. “We have always felt that a rebuild requires you to take it down, and you have a long view, that you’re going to reinvest early and middle and often, and that’s going to give you fewer valleys and a whole lot more peaks. We were very successful for five years [from 2012 to 2016], but we had a drop-off. This is designed to take us out five, seven, 10 [years], more like a Tampa Bay kind of an approach, except with bigger payrolls.”

 

 

 

The Orioles’ young core will help payroll ‘increase steadily.’ It won’t justify a meager mark in 2023. | ANALYSIS – Baltimore Sun
https://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/orioles/bs-sp-orioles-payroll-young-core-analysis-20221214-nnpcashs7nhnnli3ooek2hfoqa-story.html

Elias comment:

He added the team’s payroll would increase as revenues and attendance do, expecting those numbers to rise with the club’s improvement. The Orioles have had one of the eight lowest average home attendance figures every season since their most recent playoff berth in 2016. The club’s lease at Camden Yards is up after this season, though the team can exercise an option for a five-year extension before February, while Elias has repeatedly referenced future renovations the team has planned for the ballpark.