Another very good article from Brit

[Jagwar]

I assumed that Bradish and GRod would have given much better performances. And that Means was going to be available. 

 If only they had pitched like they pitched in September 

[SilverRocket]

5 hours ago, glenn__davis said:

Lot of respect for Britt.  But the article is wrong.

It's a crapshoot.  It will always be a crapshoot.  

Yeah, you can argue about whether there was a chance to get an extra reliever or something, but at the end of the day this was a 101-win team. 101-win teams lose 3 out of 5 to a good team sometimes. That's just the nature of the playoffs.

I have more of a problem with the roster choices (Cole Irvin being left out) and some bullpen decisions than the player pool.

[Sports Guy]

The Orioles absolutely have to upgrade the pitching staff.

 

[Yossarian]

We can see the rosters of playoff teams we need to compete with:

Rangers have Seager, Semien, Lowe. Jung, Heim 

Dodgers have Betts, Freeman, Martinez, Smith, Muncy, Outman

Braves have Acuña,  Olson, Albies, Riley, Murphy

Do we think our young guys are going to be able to produce like these guys?  Our current vets are not to this level, so where does the production come from?  There is room for improvement, but I don't know that it will all come from young guys being promoted. 

[Can_of_corn]

1 minute ago, Yossarian said:

We can see the rosters of playoff teams we need to compete with:

Rangers have Seager, Semien, Lowe. Jung, Heim 

Dodgers have Betts, Freeman, Martinez, Smith, Muncy, Outman

Braves have Acuña,  Olson, Albies, Riley, Murphy

Do we think our young guys are going to be able to produce like these guys?  Our current vets are not to this level, so where does the production come from?  There is room for improvement, but I don't know that it will all come from young guys being promoted. 

It ain't coming from free agents or trading surplus pitching.

[now]

5 hours ago, Yossarian said:

We can see the rosters of playoff teams we need to compete with:

Rangers have Seager, Semien, Lowe. Jung, Heim 

Dodgers have Betts, Freeman, Martinez, Smith, Muncy, Outman

Braves have Acuña,  Olson, Albies, Riley, Murphy

Do we think our young guys are going to be able to produce like these guys?  Our current vets are not to this level, so where does the production come from?  There is room for improvement, but I don't know that it will all come from young guys being promoted. 

This argument sounds the same as the preseason prognosticators: just leaning toward the known names. It's like our 101-win season never happened. In fact our young unknowns and current vets had a season record just shy of the Braves, and better than the Dodgers and Rays, in a better division. Name recognition is overrated, and often just masks pessimism, afraid the other guys are always better. Remember where we started, 1966?

[Chavez Ravine]

8 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

The Orioles absolutely have to upgrade the pitching staff.

 

The story of the season is how this pitching somehow managed to get them this far. It has perhaps overachieved and is definitely thin. It needs more depth across the organization. Deadline deals for relief pitching? Whatever. It works and fails with equal measure. Chapman is very capable in the next few days of inspiring another writer to wonder what in the world the Rangers were thinking.

[Roy Firestone]

11 hours ago, Jagwar said:

I assumed that Bradish and GRod would have given much better performances. And that Means was going to be available. 

 If only they had pitched like they pitched in September 

Bradish was fine. Grod wasnt.

[Yossarian]

3 hours ago, now said:

This argument sounds the same as the preseason prognosticators: just leaning toward the known names. It's like our 101-win season never happened. In fact our young unknowns and current vets had a season record just shy of the Braves, and better than the Dodgers and Rays, in a better division. Name recognition is overrated, and often just masks pessimism, afraid the other guys are always better. Remember where we started, 1966?

I wasn't making the argument that the Orioles need to go buy "big names" in the off season.  I was simply stating that other teams in the playoffs with the "big names" get production from most of those guys and it is that production that the Orioles must match or exceed with whatever team they put together. 

Having said that,  the Dodgers are facing the same crisis as the Orioles, but with a lot higher payroll for those "big names" that they went out and got.   That must please Angelos.

[Sports Guy]

5 hours ago, Chavez Ravine said:

The story of the season is how this pitching somehow managed to get them this far. It has perhaps overachieved and is definitely thin. It needs more depth across the organization. Deadline deals for relief pitching? Whatever. It works and fails with equal measure. Chapman is very capable in the next few days of inspiring another writer to wonder what in the world the Rangers were thinking.

1) Felix isn’t here next year. 
 

2) Just because guys overachieved in 2023 doesn’t mean they will in 2024.

[wildcard]

38 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

1) Felix isn’t here next year. 
 

2) Just because guys overachieved in 2023 doesn’t mean they will in 2024.

Next season Cowser, Kjerstad, Ortiz, Holliday, McDermott and Mayo will be available to the team.   I agree that the bullpen needs to be upgraded this off season.   The O's spent 18m on Gibson and Frazier.  I don't think either will be back next year.   That money should be spent on pitching.

[Roll Tide]

21 hours ago, Jim'sKid26 said:

https://theathletic.com/4943661/2023/10/08/orioles-alds-game-2-loss/

"At this year’s trade deadline, the Orioles and Rangers were contending teams with solid lineups and questions about the playoff viability of their pitching staffs. One team pushed all its chips to the middle of the poker table days before the deadline. The other hoarded most of its own, unwilling to match the risk, before playing the nickel slots."

"The Orioles believe they can win three in a row. They’ve believed in themselves all year. But no matter what ends up happening from here, the message is clear: If they want to compete on baseball’s biggest stage, the Orioles are going to have to make some bigger moves."

I think she makes a rather compelling case. Say what you want about the playoffs being a crapshoot, but this team lacks playoff experience and impact players at several key positions. I hope I'm wrong, but I see 3 and out.

Honestly, the Orioles lost the first game and struggled most recently due to offense. I agree the Flaherty move was a dud. 

[Roll Tide]

15 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Next season Cowser, Kjerstad, Ortiz, Holliday, McDermott and Mayo will be available to the team.   I agree that the bullpen needs to be upgraded this off season.   The O's spent 18m on Gibson and Frazier.  I don't think either will be back next year.   That money should be spent on pitching.

I’m sure you won’t be happy with what a meager $18 million gets us. In the past the Orioles moves were half measures. With John Angelos being tight I fear the same. 

[glenn__davis]

1 hour ago, Sports Guy said:

1) Felix isn’t here next year. 
 

2) Just because guys overachieved in 2023 doesn’t mean they will in 2024.

 First, I 100% agree that the pitching staff needs to be bolstered.

That said, outside of Cano I'm not really sure who on the pitching staff overachieved.  Bradish took a big step forward but I think a lot of that was due to adjustments.  Rodriguez was a top prospect.  Kremer and Wells basically replicated last year.  Gibson was about what we thought he'd be.

I think most of us expected Perez to take a step back, which he did, but I'm encouraged with how he ended the year.

I guess ultimately I don't look at this staff and think wow, we just had a flukey year where everyone exceeded expectations.  Again, outside of Cano.

[Jagwar]

5 hours ago, Roy Firestone said:

Bradish was fine. Grod wasnt.

Bradish gave up 7H and 1BB on 84 pitches in 4.2 innings.  The bullpen had to cover 4.1 innings. That wasn't the type of performance I was expecting Bradish to provide, but I suppose it wasn't the turd GRod laid on the mound.