Orioles Reach Out To Prince Fielder's Representatives

[Austin]

Who did the Rays trade in their rebuild process?

Delmon Young (and some minor pieces) were traded for Matt Garza and Jason Bartlett, two players that made huge contributions to the Rays' success. Eventually, the two of them (and some minor pieces) were flipped for a total of ten players. You don't think those moves worked out for the Rays?

[weams]

let me guess... my brotha Dip had a liquid lunch

"Tis the season.

[clapdiddy]

Kind of like the Sherrill trade? Or the Tejada trade? How about Cliff Lee? Did the Indians make out well on that trade? Look at what the Rangers got for Tex when they traded him to Atlanta.

Not trying to pile on here, but comparing the return for Cliff Lee and Mark Texeira to Sherrill and Tejada isn't exactly apples to apples.

[Brendan25]

Delmon Young was traded for Matt Garza and Jason Bartlett, two players that made huge contributions to the Rays' success. Eventually, the two of them were flipped for a total of ten players. You don't think those moves worked out for the Rays?

Matt Garza and Jason Bartlett were both major league ballplayers who had success at the major league level. The Rays knew what they were getting when they traded Delmon Young. Completely different scenario then trading a player like Jones or Guthrie for 5 minor league players with "potential".

I am all for trading for players like Garza and Bartlett. What I don't want is the key to the trade be a player who has had success in the minor leagues with potential to be good at the major league level.

[Dipper9]

"Tis the season.

Can I refill your egg nog? Get you something to eat? Take you out to the middle of nowhere, leave ya for dead?

[weams]

Can I refill your egg nog? Get you something to eat? Take you out to the middle of nowhere, leave ya for dead?

"Naw, I'm doing just fine Clark."

[DrungoHazewood]

Kind of like the Sherrill trade? Or the Tejada trade? How about Cliff Lee? Did the Indians make out well on that trade? Look at what the Rangers got for Tex when they traded him to Atlanta.

You and I are just on completely different pages. There are trades out there that turn out fairly well. Most of the time however the team that trades the best player for the prospects get the low end of the deal. The best player the Indians got for CC was LaPorta. He is never going to be that all-star player they wanted him to be.

If a player like Adam Jones or Jeremy Guthrie is a year away from hitting free agency, and they are not willing to sign an extension, then you absolutely trade that player and get what you can get for them. If a player of Adam Jones capability is willing to sign an extension here then you absolutely do not trade him because most likely you will not get back the type of productivity that Jones could have given you. Go back and look. Look at the last 4-5 years at the biggest trade deadline deals and let me know how many of the teams that traded the star player got back what they wanted to get back.

I think there is some exaggeration of the odds of a group of prospects panning out. There's also the effect of teams resigning their own players to more success than resigning other's free agents.

If the O's think that Jones is worthwhile to extend that's not a bad option. But, they have to do a cost-benefit analysis, and determine if they can get more in trade than the surplus value they'll likely get out of his contract extension.

This isn't a black or white issue, you can't just say that it's bad to trade players nearing the end of their team-controlled period, nor can you make a blanket statement that you must trade them.

But you have to have good scouting and analysis to do that analysis, and the O's haven't had that in the past, and I'm not sure they do now. They've been at a disadvantage no matter what course they took.

Matt Garza and Jason Bartlett were both major league ballplayers who had success at the major league level. The Rays knew what they were getting when they traded Delmon Young. Completely different scenario then trading a player like Jones or Guthrie for 5 minor league players with "potential".

I am all for trading for players like Garza and Bartlett. What I don't want is the key to the trade be a player who has had success in the minor leagues with potential to be good at the major league level.

Garza and Bartlett offered some more value than comparable minor leaguers because of somewhat higher confidence in their projections going forward. But higher uncertainty just adds to the risk profile of the deal, and requires more potential value coming back. There's no reason to not trade for prospects, just so long as you've adequately assessed and accounted for risk.

[Bradysburns]

Yes...completely different pages.

I want them to build the team properly.

At one time, I couldn't stand your self-superiority. But now I kind of like it.

[Brendan25]

I think there is some exaggeration of the odds of a group of prospects panning out. There's also the effect of teams resigning their own players to more success than resigning other's free agents.

If the O's think that Jones is worthwhile to extend that's not a bad option. But, they have to do a cost-benefit analysis, and determine if they can get more in trade than the surplus value they'll likely get out of his contract extension.

This isn't a black or white issue, you can't just say that it's bad to trade players nearing the end of their team-controlled period, nor can you make a blanket statement that you must trade them.

But you have to have good scouting and analysis to do that analysis, and the O's haven't had that in the past, and I'm not sure they do now. They've been at a disadvantage no matter what course they took.

I absolutely agree. Nobody knows if Jones is or is not willing to sign an extension here. I have heard some people say it seems like Jones hates it here. I have heard a couple reporters say that Jones is happy here. If Jones is willing to sign an extension here, my personal opinion is that he holds more value to this team then Smoak, Gutierez, and a A prospect. Just my opinion. I agree that if he is not willing to sign an extension here, or next year comes around and he still hasn't signed that a trade has to be looked at.

Garza and Bartlett offered some more value than comparable minor leaguers because of somewhat higher confidence in their projections going forward. But higher uncertainty just adds to the risk profile of the deal, and requires more potential value coming back. There's no reason to not trade for prospects, just so long as you've adequately assessed and accounted for risk.

................

[DrungoHazewood]

I absolutely agree. Nobody knows if Jones is or is not willing to sign an extension here. I have heard some people say it seems like Jones hates it here. I have heard a couple reporters say that Jones is happy here. If Jones is willing to sign an extension here, my personal opinion is that he holds more value to this team then Smoak, Gutierez, and a A prospect. Just my opinion. I agree that if he is not willing to sign an extension here, or next year comes around and he still hasn't signed that a trade has to be looked at.

With the new CBA you really have to look to trade him no later than the spring of 2013. You can't let the 2013 season start without a trade or an extension, because as soon as that happens compensation is out the window for the team he's going to, so his value drops by at least several $million.

But under any CBA his trade value falls as his time under contract decreases. So every day of the 2012 season his trade value falls, too. Part of the reason the O's got such a good package for Erik Bedard was that he still had two seasons remaining before free agency.

I think that if you get a bad feeling from Jones and his agent concerning an extension you have to look to deal him sooner than later.

[Brendan25]

With the new CBA you really have to look to trade him no later than the spring of 2013. You can't let the 2013 season start without a trade or an extension, because as soon as that happens compensation is out the window for the team he's going to, so his value drops by at least several $million.

But under any CBA his trade value falls as his time under contract decreases. So every day of the 2012 season his trade value falls, too. Part of the reason the O's got such a good package for Erik Bedard was that he still had two seasons remaining before free agency.

I think that if you get a bad feeling from Jones and his agent concerning an extension you have to look to deal him sooner than later.

I agree. Do you think that DD feels the same way?

[JTrea81]

Yes...completely different pages.

I want them to build the team properly.

It does not matter how the team is built, rather it's about winning and sustaining winning.

How you get there and stay there is irrelevant.

There is no proper way to build a winning team, because every team is different.

[Sports Guy]

It does not matter how the team is built, rather it's about winning and sustaining winning.

Ironically, you have yet to show any of your ideas that accomplishes either, much less both.

[Roll Tide]

From Heyman

2. The young slugger. Prince Fielder is being packaged as the much younger alternative of two great hitters. Fielder is only 27 while Pujols is 31, and the predictable whispers that Pujols is actually older have already started (Dan LeBatard of the Miami Herald said the Marlins believe Pujols is older, and Marlins owner Jeffrey Loria, asked about that the other day, said he was declining comment on that and any other free agent questions). In any case, Fielder, who has played more games than anyone the last four years despite a thick body, is seeking a deal similar to the one Pujols has yet to take. The Nationals, Mariners, Orioles, Rangers and Cubs seem like potential players.

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/jon_heyman/11/28/december.storylines/index.html#ixzz1fE7DIMD8

[Orioles West]

From Heyman

Read more: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/jon_heyman/11/28/december.storylines/index.html#ixzz1fE7DIMD8

The key there is it is Heyman, who throws every single thing against the wall and hopes something sticks. That said, I know the O's are not going for shortcuts, but it would still be cool watching Prince hit the Warehouse a few times.

-Don