Guthrie traded to Rockies for Hammel & Lindstrom

[Greg]

danconnollysunDan Connolly

2B/OF Eric Young Jr., 26, also was in Guthrie trade talks. O's eventually saw no fit and said no. He's out of options, O's roster at 40+

[Austin]

According to Connolly, the O's rejected Young as part of the deal...

2B/OF Eric Young Jr., 26, also was in Guthrie trade talks. O's eventually saw no fit and said no. He's out of options, O's roster at 40+

[allstar1579]

This is basically how I feel. If Hammel and Lindstrom is all you can get for Guthrie then you hold onto him and hope he pitches well and the market improves at the trading deadline. Middle of the rotation starters have more value in July to a contending team then they do in February when there are still FA options and the bloom hasn't fallen off your own in house options yet.

Basically DD traded Guthrie when his value was at its lowest. Maybe Hammel can come back to the AL East and pitch well, but there are a lot of things to not like about his career pitch values along with his peripherals last year and I'm not a big fan of national league pitchers making the transition into the AL East.

Should also be mentioned that Guthrie wanted to extend here and we wouldn't do it. It will be interesting to see who they DO spend $10m/year on to replace him in a year when they realize they need 200IP in the middle of the rotation.

[Sports Guy]

If Hammel replaces Guthrie and the hard throwing Lindstrom pitches like he did last year, aren't they both just as, if not more, valuable trade chips at the deadline? Guthrie is a one year rental. I think he would have done well in just about any other NL city but he might just not be that highly regarded by other teams. The trade, on paper, is a wash, with either team having a chance of winning it. Hammel and Lindstrom could bomb and have no value or they could both do well and have value. Again, it's not exciting but it's a sideways trade. From the O's perspective that got talent, depth and cost certainty over the next two years.

I have basically already said all of this in this thread...So I do agree...But I would rather have the younger players right now, as opposed to hoping things work out.

[allstar1579]

danconnollysunDan Connolly

2B/OF Eric Young Jr., 26, also was in Guthrie trade talks. O's eventually saw no fit and said no. He's out of options, O's roster at 40+

That's interesting. I don't see why they couldn't have had Young in addition for nothing, being out of options, and I think he might have also been worth a look at 2B.

[Mr Snuffleupagus]

This is basically how I feel. If Hammel and Lindstrom is all you can get for Guthrie then you hold onto him and hope he pitches well and the market improves at the trading deadline. Middle of the rotation starters have more value in July to a contending team then they do in February when there are still FA options and the bloom hasn't fallen off your own in house options yet.

Basically DD traded Guthrie when his value was at its lowest. Maybe Hammel can come back to the AL East and pitch well, but there are a lot of things to not like about his career pitch values along with his peripherals last year and I'm not a big fan of national league pitchers making the transition into the AL East.

So Guthrie would be worth more with only 6 months worth of service time left as opposed to 1 year? How well would he have to perform this season for that to be the case?

I think LookinUp is right, what could you really expect in return come July that would be clearly better then what we got now? I mean, I can understand preferring prospects to what we just got, but if Guthrie is pitching to the tune of a 4.5 ERA come July, and is still owed $4.5m, aren't we in a worst bargaining position then we are now?

[TonySoprano]

Buster Olney @Buster_ESPN

Sources say the talks about settling Guthrie's arbitration case were contentious; maybe the O's just decided they wouldn't pay him big $.

[Singleton]

It's an indefensibly bad trade. We're going to be a bad team in 2012. We all know that. We need young players with promise. If Guthrie can't get us that in Feb 2012 (and I think he could), then you hold on to him and hope for better or you take the draft pick. There is no point in trading for spare parts.

The most depressing part to this deal though isn't the players involved but that it is further indication of DD's mindset that is NOT determined to acquire young talent but to nibble around the edges and hope we are mediocre. Whooopeee.

[allstar1579]

So Guthrie would be worth more with only 6 months worth of service time left as opposed to 1 year? How well would he have to perform this season for that to be the case?

I think LookinUp is right, what could you really expect in return come July that would be clearly better then what we got now? I mean, I can understand preferring prospects to what we just got, but if Guthrie is pitching to the tune of a 4.5 ERA come July, and is still owed $4.5m, aren't we in a worst bargaining position then we are now?

Yes, because at 6 months out you are in contention for that season already, you know where you stand and adding a solid starter to stabilize the rotation or replace someone who has been injured that doesn't require a long commitment is a bonus to a lot of contenders each year.

[allstar1579]

There have been comments by Buck about the young pitchers not having good examples. That pretty much goes 100% against Guthrie's reputation but you never got the impression that Buck viewed Guthrie as a leader on the staff. He never said much about him. From my own persepctive, Guthrie seems like a standup guy but I always felt he pitched better when his team was behind, which of course happened a lot.

Yeah that's why it struck me a little odd. Might just be reading into things too much, and he was thanking people that gave him a shot when he wasn't proven yet, BUT the fact that Buck never talks about him could be a negative too. Guthrie is a great guy and a person that the young pitchers should be looking up to.

[tilgaham]

Orioles trading a 105 career ERA+ starter for a 92+ starter and a rock solid reliever. We must be high on Wada and Chen.

[MrOrange82]

I only made it to page 8 of the thread, but I'm in a hurry, so here's my take away: the sky's still blue, and the O's are still stupid. Wish I could claim surprise.

[Singleton]

Do those who were opposed to trading Guthrie to CIN for Alonso last year prefer this return?

I'd prefer Alonso of course but do we really know this could have been done or is this more of "X reported on Y website that Reds are interested in .... and O's have said..."

I despise the Colorado trade but I'm not sure this angle is fair -- though perhaps I'm just not in the know.

[Greg]

JonHeymanCBSJon Heyman

i am finding some of #orioles moves this winter confounding, perplexing and just downright weird

[TonySoprano]

Yeah, obviously the timing of the trade says a lot. This could be a 100% DD trade or it could be Angelos telling him to get what he can before the arbitration case gets settled.

I mentioned that earlier

The upcoming arbitration hearing might have been a factor. Reportedly the two sides were far apart.

He was supposed to have an arbitration hearing today vs. the Smousenator.