Dan Duquette: No teams were willing to offer us young prospects in return for Guthrie

[weams]

Well I think this is combined with what SG says to give the reason.

I bet they were concerned he was going to fade this year due to peripherals + the behind the scenes stuff + the arb situation.

Seems like DD and company were betting Guthrie was going to be bad or worse than he has the last few years this season. This could affect his status as a FA (and subsequent draft picks) or his trade value at the deadline. And thus they felt the need to move him now.

I agree we should have held onto him though...

He was never, ever, going to be a type A. There was a good chance he was not going to be a type B. I am not sure exactly how this all works with the new CBA but I feel quite certain that he would have netted a Supplemental only.

It appears that the Orioles are betting on Hamel being worth as much as Guthrie.

Change for Change sake is my motto.

[NCRaven]

Which makes more sense for us...and I think he brings back more than that depending on how he pitches.

BTW, you could make the argument that he is starting in the playoffs for a team like Detroit.

Too bad Detroit doesn't think so.

[BaltimoreTerp]

You can't put pepperjack cheese on this #$%& sandwich and make it taste better, Dan.

You also can't call a ham sandwich a **** sandwich and have it be so.

[UMDTerrapins]

Guthrie is pitching for a contract.....his first and last meaningful chance for a multiyear deal. If these two guys is all you can get right now, you just stand pat knowing he'll be giving this season everything he has, and may end up giving you a better return midseason. But the time to deal him was long long ago.

[crawjo]

I think Guthrie would have had to pitch significantly better than he has in the recent past for him to have netted a decent prospect at the trade deadline. Teams aren't going to give away good prospects for expensive back of the rotation starters who are about to become free agents. Those kinds of pitchers tend to be moved only in salary dump situations.

People on this board have consistently overrated Guthrie for years...not surprising considering that over the last four seasons he's been the only competent starting pitcher on the staff. But that's all he is: competent.

[TakebackOPACY]

He was never, ever, going to be a type A. There was a good chance he was not going to be a type B. I am not sure exactly how this all works with the new CBA but I feel quite certain that he would have netted a Supplemental only.

It appears that the Orioles are betting on Hamel being worth as much as Guthrie.

Change for Change sake is my motto.

Under the old system and Elias rankings, Guthrie wasn't even a Type B this off-season. That was absurd; if he were playing for any other team in the AL, he probably would've been a Type B. His ranking was driven down by wins and win-loss percentage.

Under the new agreement, to get compensation, they would have had to offer him a one-year contract with a salary equivalent to the average of the Top 125 players in baseball. That stands at about $12.4m right now.

EDIT: Sources

http://espn.go.com/mlb/story/_/id/7255517/new-major-league-baseball-cba-include-testing-hgh-according-sources

http://mlb.sbnation.com/2011/11/23/2581637/major-league-baseball-cba-labor-agreement

http://www.mlbtraderumors.com/2011/09/2010-11-reverse-engineered-elias-rankings.html (These are the reverse-engineered rankings from mlbtraderumors, not the official rankings. I can't find the full official rankings.)

[ShaneDawg85]

I'm not sure that I buy the statement at face value, but if that is the case then you hold onto him until the trade deadline. Some team out there would overpay for Jeremy Guthrie as long as he hadn't crapped the bed. It's happened enough times. This was making a deal for reasons that had nothing to do with the long-term vision of the club, pure and simple.

[Sports Guy]

Too bad Detroit doesn't think so.

Yes they do...they wanted him last year and ended up getting Fister instead because the Orioles wanted more.

What Seattle got for Fister made more sense for this team than this deal did.

[ledzepp8]

Hard to believe that is because people don't think Guthrie is any good...that is GM driven to me.

But you don't even think he's good.

Most of the people complaining about the return for Guthrie wouldn't have given up what they think the O's should have gotten, if they were the team trading for Guthrie.

[Sports Guy]

But you don't even think he's good.

Most of the people complaining about the return for Guthrie wouldn't have given up what they think the O's should have gotten, if they were the team trading for Guthrie.

I didn't feel he would make it as a starter like 4 years ago.

People's inability to read and understand what has been said since is pretty freaking stupid.

I have said, SEVERAL TIMES, that I feel he is a mid rotation type guy...that doesn';t mean I think he's not good.

[ledzepp8]

I didn't feel he would make it as a starter like 4 years ago.

People's inability to read and understand what has been said since is pretty freaking stupid.

I have said, SEVERAL TIMES, that I feel he is a mid rotation type guy...that doesn';t mean I think he's not good.

I didn't mean it as you didn't appreciate his role on the team or his contribution or didn't think he belonged.

Bottom line is what would you have given up to get Guthrie, if the roles were reversed and we were trying to get him from Colorado?

[Birds of B'more]

I accepted this as true without his needing to address it. I think the question is would we have preferred to keep GUTS to the guys we landed.

To which my reply is "yes." With Guthrie, you know what you're going to get, and looking at the rest of the rotation that kind of consistency and reliability is paramount. With Hammel, they hope to get what he did a couple years ago, and not last season, and even then it's only as good as what you'd get from Guthrie. And Lindstrom is the sort of BP arm they could have acquired by other means if they were so inclined.

[atomic]

I didn't mean it as you didn't appreciate his role on the team or his contribution or didn't think he belonged.

Bottom line is what would you have given up to get Guthrie, if the roles were reversed and we were trying to get him from Colorado?

Reynolds.

[Sports Guy]

I didn't mean it as you didn't appreciate his role on the team or his contribution or didn't think he belonged.

Bottom line is what would you have given up to get Guthrie, if the roles were reversed and we were trying to get him from Colorado?

If I were Colorado, I probably don't make the trade because I don't see it helping them all that much.

But if I were a real contender and needed a solid mid to back rotation guy who can eat innings, I would have no issue giving up a few B prospects or something like that for him.

[cnmilton]

Here's a thought: Considering he took a lesser deal than the O's submitted in arbitration, is it possithat Guthrie asked to be traded?