Mussina elected to Orioles Hall of Fame! (Also Dauer and Youse) w/Mussina reaction

[cindyluvsbrady]

NO ONE can make love Moo$$$$$$E

[cindyluvsbrady]

:002_scry::epic:I love the OS HOF ceremony.... Lets Pray he behaves!!!!

[cindyluvsbrady]

Palmeiro should be in, if for nothing else, since one of his comp picks got us Brian Roberts.

You mean My Perfect One!!!!!!!!:hearts::hearts::hearts::hearts:

[TonySoprano]

Has anyone's position on this changed since this thread started?

[Bradysburns]

Moose was part of the last winning era of Orioles baseball, and he was our ace when I fell in love with this starcrossed team. For what he did, we should put him in the Orioles HOF. I think it's important to separate what he did for us, and what he did after. Would it have been any less offensive if he had gone to the Mariners, for example?

That said, I hate the Yankees with a violent passion. So everything he did after he left was in the name of pure evil. That's why it's important to realize that his induction into the Orioles HOF ONLY reflects his time here, and not ANYTHING he did afterwards. We're not honoring him for his entire career, just what he did as an Oriole. And this organization should strive toward class, and doing things right, even if it's not easy. I feel Tony's outrage, but ultimately don't think the team should make a decision based on it. But that's why I appreciate Tony's takes so much... He wears his heart on his sleeve.

In a way, you could say that's the right thing to do as a fan. But inducting Moose is the right thing to do as an organization.

[24fps]

Has anyone's position on this changed since this thread started?

Mine has changed quite often, and continues to do so. As an Orioles fan, nothing brings out conflicting emotions in me like the subject of Mike Mussina.

[ShaneDawg85]

Moose was part of the last winning era of Orioles baseball, and he was our ace when I fell in love with this starcrossed team. For what he did, we should put him in the Orioles HOF. I think it's important to separate what he did for us, and what he did after. Would it have been any less offensive if he had gone to the Mariners, for example?

That said, I hate the Yankees with a violent passion. So everything he did after he left was in the name of pure evil. That's why it's important to realize that his induction into the Orioles HOF ONLY reflects his time here, and not ANYTHING he did afterwards. We're not honoring him for his entire career, just what he did as an Oriole. And this organization should strive toward class, and doing things right, even if it's not easy. I feel Tony's outrage, but ultimately don't think the team should make a decision based on it. But that's why I appreciate Tony's takes so much... He wears his heart on his sleeve.

In a way, you could say that's the right thing to do as a fan. But inducting Moose is the right thing to do as an organization.

Sadly for some it would have been. It was over a decade ago, people. Get over it.

[srock]

As much as I don't want to feel the same way. I do. Mussina was my 2nd favorite player (behind Cal) growing up and when he went to the Yankees I almost threw up.

Pretty much. I understood then and now Mussina going somewhere else, but he didn't have to hide behind the evil empire. Effective or not, to me he always looked like a beaten shell of himself pitching in pin stripes.

However, Frobby is also right. He does belong in the Orioles Hall of Fame becasue the numbers put him there.

Bigger question, if Mussina belongs in the HOF on his numbers alone, does this not imply Palmeiro needs to be included regardless of his fall from grace?

[ShaneDawg85]

Pretty much. I understood then and now Mussina going somewhere else, but he didn't have to hide behind the evil empire. Effective or not, to me he always looked like a beaten shell of himself pitching in pin stripes.

However, Frobby is also right. He does belong in the Orioles Hall of Fame becasue the numbers put him there.

Bigger question, if Mussina belongs in the HOF on his numbers alone, does this not imply Palmeiro needs to be included regardless of his fall from grace?

There's no question Palmeiro should be in the OHOF, and one day, many years from now, I think it will happen. But, it's still too fresh in people's mind, it's still a controversial subject for people, and even though I think Angelos had a fondness for him and clearly has been able to let some of the past slide with letting Moose in (although I don't think that's the whole reason Moose is being inducted), I don't think it will happen until after Angelos has left this world.

[TonySoprano]

Bigger question, if Mussina belongs in the HOF on his numbers alone, does this not imply Palmeiro needs to be included regardless of his fall from grace?

Numbers wise, the bar isn't set all that high to be inducted into the O's Hall of Fame.

Palmeiro has the same OPS+ (127) in his seven years here that Harold Baines also had in seven years with Baltimore. Raffy has 261 more games playing for the O's than Mike Bordick. Chris Hoiles played more seasons here, but being a catcher, he played fewer games in ten years than Palmeiro did in seven, and Palmeiro was a better hitter. B.J. Surhoff played one more game, total, but once again Palmeiro wins the numbers comparison. "The Big Bopper," Lee May was here for five years, and again, Palmeiro wins on the numbers. Diamond Jim Gentile was only here for four years.

I'm not making the case against any of the above. Instead, I'm saying if they belong, so does Palmeiro...on the numbers.

Like Mussina, Palmeiro is eligible, and like Mussina, he left under very unpopular circumstances. However, unlike Mussina, Palmeiro's name is under a huge cloud nationally. Cooperstown has kept their doors closed to him.

As I said in a previous post, I am surprised that Angelos allowed Mussina's induction. "Time heals all wounds?" Therefore, Palmeiro is a possibility.

[Dipper9]

Numbers wise, the bar isn't set all that high to be inducted into the O's Hall of Fame.

Palmeiro has the same OPS+ (127) in his seven years here that Harold Baines also had in seven years with Baltimore. Raffy has 261 more games playing for the O's than Mike Bordick. Chris Hoiles played more seasons here, but being a catcher, he played fewer games in ten years than Palmeiro did in seven, and Palmeiro was a better hitter. B.J. Surhoff played one more game, total, but once again Palmeiro wins the numbers comparison. "The Big Bopper," Lee May was here for five years, and again, Palmeiro wins on the numbers. Diamond Jim Gentile was only here for four years.

I'm not making the case against any of the above. Instead, I'm saying if they belong, so does Palmeiro...on the numbers.

Like Mussina, Palmeiro is eligible, and like Mussina, he left under very unpopular circumstances. However, unlike Mussina, Palmeiro's name is under a huge cloud nationally. Cooperstown has kept their doors closed to him.

As I said in a previous post, I am surprised that Angelos allowed Mussina's induction. "Time heals all wounds?" Therefore, Palmeiro is a possibility.

So you're saying, one day, Tony Soprano and Peter Angelos will hug on the pitchers mound during Game 7 of the Orioles World Series?

[srock]

Numbers wise, the bar isn't set all that high to be inducted into the O's Hall of Fame.

Palmeiro has the same OPS+ (127) in his seven years here that Harold Baines also had in seven years with Baltimore. Raffy has 261 more games playing for the O's than Mike Bordick. Chris Hoiles played more seasons here, but being a catcher, he played fewer games in ten years than Palmeiro did in seven, and Palmeiro was a better hitter. B.J. Surhoff played one more game, total, but once again Palmeiro wins the numbers comparison. "The Big Bopper," Lee May was here for five years, and again, Palmeiro wins on the numbers. Diamond Jim Gentile was only here for four years.

I'm not making the case against any of the above. Instead, I'm saying if they belong, so does Palmeiro...on the numbers.

Like Mussina, Palmeiro is eligible, and like Mussina, he left under very unpopular circumstances. However, unlike Mussina, Palmeiro's name is under a huge cloud nationally. Cooperstown has kept their doors closed to him.

As I said in a previous post, I am surprised that Angelos allowed Mussina's induction. "Time heals all wounds?" Therefore, Palmeiro is a possibility.

I agree, Palmeiro deserves to be in just like Mussina.

But deserves is different from the fans wanting him in. I don't want either player in based purely on nostalgia, which isn't a bad reason for a team HOF, methinks. At least not right now, time could heal, as you have said.

[TonySoprano]

So you're saying, one day, Tony Soprano and Peter Angelos will hug on the pitchers mound during Game 7 of the Orioles World Series?

Hug? (see my avatar). Shake hands? Yeah, particularly if Pete pays the necessary tribute and gives me comp tickets to game 7.

[ShaneDawg85]

Numbers wise, the bar isn't set all that high to be inducted into the O's Hall of Fame.

Palmeiro has the same OPS+ (127) in his seven years here that Harold Baines also had in seven years with Baltimore. Raffy has 261 more games playing for the O's than Mike Bordick. Chris Hoiles played more seasons here, but being a catcher, he played fewer games in ten years than Palmeiro did in seven, and Palmeiro was a better hitter. B.J. Surhoff played one more game, total, but once again Palmeiro wins the numbers comparison. "The Big Bopper," Lee May was here for five years, and again, Palmeiro wins on the numbers. Diamond Jim Gentile was only here for four years.

I'm not making the case against any of the above. Instead, I'm saying if they belong, so does Palmeiro...on the numbers.

Like Mussina, Palmeiro is eligible, and like Mussina, he left under very unpopular circumstances. However, unlike Mussina, Palmeiro's name is under a huge cloud nationally. Cooperstown has kept their doors closed to him.

As I said in a previous post, I am surprised that Angelos allowed Mussina's induction. "Time heals all wounds?" Therefore, Palmeiro is a possibility.

I am as well, because I said in my previous post, I don't know that I wholly buy Mussina is getting in simply for time healing wounds. Obviously there's what he actually did as an Oriole, which I've adamantly stated should trump everything else. However, I'm largely of the view that Moose is being inducted so as to fill Pete's desire to have a ceremony, and because frankly the list of guys who actually should be in keeps getting smaller and smaller.

[Tony-OH]

Numbers wise, the bar isn't set all that high to be inducted into the O's Hall of Fame.

Palmeiro has the same OPS+ (127) in his seven years here that Harold Baines also had in seven years with Baltimore. Raffy has 261 more games playing for the O's than Mike Bordick. Chris Hoiles played more seasons here, but being a catcher, he played fewer games in ten years than Palmeiro did in seven, and Palmeiro was a better hitter. B.J. Surhoff played one more game, total, but once again Palmeiro wins the numbers comparison. "The Big Bopper," Lee May was here for five years, and again, Palmeiro wins on the numbers. Diamond Jim Gentile was only here for four years.

I'm not making the case against any of the above. Instead, I'm saying if they belong, so does Palmeiro...on the numbers.

Like Mussina, Palmeiro is eligible, and like Mussina, he left under very unpopular circumstances. However, unlike Mussina, Palmeiro's name is under a huge cloud nationally. Cooperstown has kept their doors closed to him.

As I said in a previous post, I am surprised that Angelos allowed Mussina's induction. "Time heals all wounds?" Therefore, Palmeiro is a possibility.

If we are going to put a Yankee in, might as well put a steroid-user in. I think Jay Gibbons should be in as well.