Duquette owes it to the team and City to go for it...

[Jonesy10]

I think what other posters have been trying to explain is that you can't simply take snapshots of Jones' past performances and say "here, look, he's done better in the past," because you're taking those performances out of context. Jones' offensive output has been fairly consistent year-to-year, and the kinds of differences you're focusing on have more to do with offense around baseball trending down than with Jones' actual capabilities and/or production.

That's a fair point. I was more knocking CD, JJ, and Manny though which is why I was really confused so many took offense.

[mark_beckens]

I think what other posters have been trying to explain is that you can't simply take snapshots of Jones' past performances and say "here, look, he's done better in the past," because you're taking those performances out of context. Jones' offensive output has been fairly consistent year-to-year, and the kinds of differences you're focusing on have more to do with offense around baseball trending down than with Jones' actual capabilities and/or production.

Thank you for that, I wasn't willing to take the time.

One hot week/month and he's at or ahead of pace. The season isn't 2/3 done yet.

[Teddy OBP]

What do you think would happen a few years from now if we traded away all or most of our top 5 prospects for the chance to win a WS this season?

8-8 isn't competitive in the NFL. You may back into a playoff appearance but all 8-8 means is you have an average QB.

But you've got a championship. I don't think the team is ever going back to the twenty years of bad even if they had to start over. I think they've learned lessons (and will have a different owner during the next twenty years too.

Obviously 8-8 is not good enough but it's competitive. 9-7 would have won the division the past three years and they were in all three games. The Packers and Giants (twice) have then won a Super Bowl after that regular season performance.

I would never trade them all but several or most to guarantee a AS is worth it. Except it's never a guarantee. Presumably you could regain products in following seasons by trading vets or with QO's sonce the team dropped off. I defer to DD.

[weams]

Except it's never a guarantee. Presumably you could regain products in following seasons by trading vets or with QO's sonce the team dropped off. I defer to DD.

The straw argument that it could be guaranteed is what makes these exercises moot. If you could guarantee me a championship and then wipe my brain clean so I did not know that we were going to win, I would savor that 1000x over. But as most of this discourse, it Is purely fantasy. So I will look for the probability of 6 seasons of an 8 percent chance vs. one season of a 14%.

[Teddy OBP]

The straw argument that it could be guaranteed is what makes these exercises moot. If you could guarantee me a championship and then wipe my brain clean so I did not know that we were going to win, I would savor that 1000x over. But as most of this discourse, it Is purely fantasy. So I will look for the probability of 6 seasons of an 8 percent chance vs. one season of a 14%.

No argument there.

[AdamK]

I think this current team can be very disruptive in the postseason, but it would be an epic story for them to win (as the roster stands now) due to deficiencies in offense without home runs and less than stellar situational hitting.

But.

I don't want to see rentals here. I don't want to send lots of young guys out for "plan D" trade partners because plans "A" through "C" were snapped up.

I think if the team can hold on to our prospects this season, deal some veteran players this offseason, and take advantage of some QO picks, things are shaping up very nicely for the Os to be a dominant team in the East even when it's not a down year.

This plan does require acquiring positional talent to start, and it's not clear who that would be at the moment, but if a GM needs a long plan - this is hopefully it.

Don't mortgage our bright future for guys who may: blow up chemistry, under perform in a new location, and walk right after the season. If they can find guys who fit into a long term plan, ok, but I doubt that happens before the 31st.

In short, stand pat.

[Dark Helmet]

I think this current team can be very disruptive in the postseason, but it would be an epic story for them to win (as the roster stands now) due to deficiencies in offense without home runs and less than stellar situational hitting.

But.

I don't want to see rentals here. I don't want to send lots of young guys out for "plan D" trade partners because plans "A" through "C" were snapped up.

I think if the team can hold on to our prospects this season, deal some veteran players this offseason, and take advantage of some QO picks, things are shaping up very nicely for the Os to be a dominant team in the East even when it's not a down year.

This plan does require acquiring positional talent to start, and it's not clear who that would be at the moment, but if a GM needs a long plan - this is hopefully it.

Don't mortgage our bright future for guys who may: blow up chemistry, under perform in a new location, and walk right after the season. If they can find guys who fit into a long term plan, ok, but I doubt that happens before the 31st.

In short, stand pat.

You don't need to mortgage the future to improve. Aaron Hill would be a great addition, and could be had cheap. Mike Carp would be worlds better than David Lough, and will be cheap. Standing pat when you have a shot at the playoffs would be a shot in the gut to guys like Jones and Markakis.

[Dark Helmet]

You don't need to mortgage the future to improve. Aaron Hill would be a great addition, and could be had cheap. Mike Carp would be worlds better than David Lough, and will be cheap. Standing pat when you have a shot at the playoffs would be a shot in the gut to guys like Jones and Markakis.

Martin Prado is another guy DD should be all over.

[weams]

You don't need to mortgage the future to improve. Aaron Hill would be a great addition, and could be had cheap. Mike Carp would be worlds better than David Lough, and will be cheap. Standing pat when you have a shot at the playoffs would be a shot in the gut to guys like Jones and Markakis.

How is Carp better than Lough?

[Dark Helmet]

How is Carp better than Lough?

It doesn't take much to be better than a guy who has a sub .290 OBP. So does it really matter how?

Prado is the guy I want anyhow.

[Jonesy10]

How is Carp better than Lough?

Carp should replace Young on the roster, to platoon with Pearce. Then try to trade Young in a package for Asdrubal Cabrera.

[weams]

It doesn't take much to be better than a guy who has a sub .290 OBP. So does it really matter how?

Prado is the guy I want anyhow.

.2 WAR says that is a downgrade.

[Dark Helmet]

.2 WAR says that is a downgrade.

Im guessing thats mostly defensive. Lough has two assets. Speed and defense. He doesn't get on enough to utilize speed. And his offense isn't good enough to be anything more than a late inning defensive replacement. Sorry, but I'll take a 40 point increase in OBP over a .2 decrease in WAR.

[Can_of_corn]

Im guessing thats mostly defensive. Lough has two assets. Speed and defense. He doesn't get on enough to utilize speed. And his offense isn't good enough to be anything more than a late inning defensive replacement. Sorry, but I'll take a 40 point increase in OBP over a .2 decrease in WAR.

Right, because run prevention isn't as good as run creation.

[El Gordo]

It doesn't take much to be better than a guy who has a sub .290 OBP. So does it really matter how?

Prado is the guy I want anyhow.

According to the Fielding Bible Total Runs, this season, Carp has been worth 7 RC 1 RS and -1 Base running Runs and Lough has been worth 10 RC 7 RS and 2 BrR