Yusniel Diaz: Where would he rank in the O's pipeline?

[Moose Milligan]

47 minutes ago, Ruzious said:

I'd put Diaz #1 over Mountcastle.  There's no getting around that .428 OBP and the ability to play either decent CF or elite RF.  

This is where I'm at.  Should be a good defender, better OBP skills.  Mountcastle can hit, no doubt but it sounds like he doesn't have a position.  Defense is another story.

Diaz sounds like he's a 5 tool guy if the power stroke develops.

[utvolzac]

Best I could find:

MLB pipeline has him ranked 84, behind Mountcastle at 79.  Not sure what the rest  of the package is but if Diaz is the centerpiece it really shows how badly the O’s bungled our most valuable trade chips.

Any reasonable person could have looked at our season two years ago and saw that minus the ridiculously hot start, we were not a legit playoff contender. The decision on extending/trading Manny should have been made then to maximize his value.

Same goes for Britton coming off the greatest season ever for a closer when teams were overvaluing relief pitching 

The fact that the Yankees got Gleyber Torres (top 5 prospect) and Frazier/Sheffield (both top prospects at the time) for Chapman/Miller and we’re going to end up with a fringe top 100 guy and some other pieces for one of the best players in the game is brutal.

That, plus completely wasting Britton’s value will set this rebuild back for years. This isn’t a hindsight reaction either, it should have been a no brainer to sell high on Britton once we saw the return on Miller/Chapman and the depth we had in our bullpen.

[Moose Milligan]

1 minute ago, utvolzac said:

Best I could find:

MLB pipeline has him ranked 84, behind Mountcastle at 79.  Not sure what the rest  of the package is but if Diaz is the centerpiece it really shows how badly the O’s bungled our most valuable trade chips.

Any reasonable person could have looked at our season two years ago and saw that minus the ridiculously hot start, we were not a legit playoff contender. The decision on extending/trading Manny should have been made then to maximize his value.

Same goes for Britton coming off the greatest season ever for a closer when teams were overvaluing relief pitching 

The fact that the Yankees got Gleyber Torres (top 5 prospect) and Frazier/Sheffield (both top prospects at the time) for Chapman/Miller and we’re going to end up with a fringe top 100 guy and some other pieces for one of the best players in the game is brutal.

That, plus completely wasting Britton’s value will set this rebuild back for years. This isn’t a hindsight reaction either, it should have been a no brainer to sell high on Britton once we saw the return on Miller/Chapman and the depth we had in our bullpen.

I agree they whiffed hard on Britton.  But to look at the rankings as to where Diaz is before the season is a bit of a disservice, IMO.  Season for MiL is going to be ending in about a month and a half, more concerned with where Diaz ends up ranked instead of where he started the season.

Even if nothing else, he's got OBP skills that aren't found on this team or our system.  That alone makes him valuable and a good get.  

 

 

[ISU94]

5 minutes ago, utvolzac said:

Best I could find:

MLB pipeline has him ranked 84, behind Mountcastle at 79.  Not sure what the rest  of the package is but if Diaz is the centerpiece it really shows how badly the O’s bungled our most valuable trade chips.

Any reasonable person could have looked at our season two years ago and saw that minus the ridiculously hot start, we were not a legit playoff contender. The decision on extending/trading Manny should have been made then to maximize his value.

Same goes for Britton coming off the greatest season ever for a closer when teams were overvaluing relief pitching 

The fact that the Yankees got Gleyber Torres (top 5 prospect) and Frazier/Sheffield (both top prospects at the time) for Chapman/Miller and we’re going to end up with a fringe top 100 guy and some other pieces for one of the best players in the game is brutal.

That, plus completely wasting Britton’s value will set this rebuild back for years. This isn’t a hindsight reaction either, it should have been a no brainer to sell high on Britton once we saw the return on Miller/Chapman and the depth we had in our bullpen.

#31

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/prospects/article/41327/2018-prospects-the-midseason-top-50/

Bummed though, eh?

[utvolzac]

1 minute ago, Moose Milligan said:

I agree they whiffed hard on Britton.  But to look at the rankings as to where Diaz is before the season is a bit of a disservice, IMO.  Season for MiL is going to be ending in about a month and a half, more concerned with where Diaz ends up ranked instead of where he started the season.

Even if nothing else, he's got OBP skills that aren't found on this team or our system.  That alone makes him valuable and a good get.  

 

 

Still a player of Manny’s caliber should net you a top 5-10 prospect, like a Torres or Acuna.

Diaz could improve, but he’s far from a sure thing. I put him in the Cisco/Hays/Mountcastle level.

Im just frustrated at this organization’s complete lack of awareness and inability to evaluate players. We should never have gotten to this point where a player of Manny’s caliber has been devalued to rental status because the idiots in the warehouse thought we had a snowball’s chance in hell of being a contender.

[Moose Milligan]

1 minute ago, utvolzac said:

Still a player of Manny’s caliber should net you a top 5-10 prospect, like a Torres or Acuna.

Diaz could improve, but he’s far from a sure thing. I put him in the Cisco/Hays/Mountcastle level.

Im just frustrated at this organization’s complete lack of awareness and inability to evaluate players. We should never have gotten to this point where a player of Manny’s caliber has been devalued to rental status because the idiots in the warehouse thought we had a snowball’s chance in hell of being a contender.

Torres and Acuna are pretty much untouchable.  

Orioles asked for Sheffield, Hiura, didn't get them.   They didn't bungle anything, except when knowing when to sell on Britton.

[Moose Milligan]

6 minutes ago, ISU94 said:

#31

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/prospects/article/41327/2018-prospects-the-midseason-top-50/

Bummed though, eh?

That's more like it.  

[utvolzac]

7 minutes ago, ISU94 said:

#31

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/prospects/article/41327/2018-prospects-the-midseason-top-50/

Bummed though, eh?

That’s more encouraging, that’s by far the highest I’ve  seen him ranked.

Still, if Chapman got Torres. Manny should have been worth ever more than that had they not waited till his free agent year.

[Moose Milligan]

9 minutes ago, ISU94 said:

#31

https://www.baseballprospectus.com/prospects/article/41327/2018-prospects-the-midseason-top-50/

Bummed though, eh?

Sweet baby Jesus, how bad is Mountcastle's defense?

 

26. Ryan Mountcastle, 3B, Baltimore Orioles

Why he’ll succeed: His hands are really good at the plate. He can wait back on his pitch and even if he commits early, he can get the barrel on the ball. Potential plus hit/plus power combination.

Why he might fail: The best thing about his defense is that he’s a really good hitter. He’s probably not long for the infield and his arm can be a liability in the outfield. That could mean first base or DH eventually and if the bat isn’t exactly as good as we think (or better), well…

[Frobby]

3 minutes ago, utvolzac said:

Still a player of Manny’s caliber should net you a top 5-10 prospect, like a Torres or Acuna.

Diaz could improve, but he’s far from a sure thing. I put him in the Cisco/Hays/Mountcastle level.

Im just frustrated at this organization’s complete lack of awareness and inability to evaluate players. We should never have gotten to this point where a player of Manny’s caliber has been devalued to rental status because the idiots in the warehouse thought we had a snowball’s chance in hell of being a contender.

That’s easy to say in hindsight, but the O’s had defied the naysayers for 5 years in a row.    They simply didn’t make it 6, largely due to bad pitching that was far worse than could have been predicted.    

[utvolzac]

2 minutes ago, Moose Milligan said:

Torres and Acuna are pretty much untouchable.  

Orioles asked for Sheffield, Hiura, didn't get them.   They didn't bungle anything, except when knowing when to sell on Britton.

He sure as hell wasnt untouchable when the Cubs traded him and he has a top 5 prospect.

My beef is that we waited till his walk year to address the Manny situation.

[Moose Milligan]

1 minute ago, utvolzac said:

He sure as hell wasnt untouchable when the Cubs traded him and he has a top 5 prospect.

My beef is that we waited till his walk year to address the Manny situation.

Co-sign on the overall bungling of the Manny situation.  

 

[oriole]

4 minutes ago, utvolzac said:

Still a player of Manny’s caliber should net you a top 5-10 prospect, like a Torres or Acuna.

Diaz could improve, but he’s far from a sure thing. I put him in the Cisco/Hays/Mountcastle level.

Im just frustrated at this organization’s complete lack of awareness and inability to evaluate players. We should never have gotten to this point where a player of Manny’s caliber has been devalued to rental status because the idiots in the warehouse thought we had a snowball’s chance in hell of being a contender.

Jim Johnson, Chris Davis, Zack Britton...hell, even Brach after his last good season. This team is terrible at recognizing the right time to trade a player. But I don't think trading Manny at any point other than maybe last offseason and now would have been appropriate. When you get a player like Machado, you hold on while you can.

[utvolzac]

Just now, Frobby said:

That’s easy to say in hindsight, but the O’s had defied the naysayers for 5 years in a row.    They simply didn’t make it 6, largely due to bad pitching that was far worse than could have been predicted.    

I disagree. Since they lost the ALCS to the Royals, minus the super hot April, they were playing .500 ball. Our last real shot at being a contender was 2015 before the Duq/Toronto disaster offseason. It’s been downhill since then.

[Moose Milligan]

2 minutes ago, oriole said:

Jim Johnson, Chris Davis, Zack Britton...hell, even Brach after his last good season. This team is terrible at recognizing the right time to trade a player. But I don't think trading Manny at any point other than maybe last offseason and now would have been appropriate. When you get a player like Machado, you hold on while you can.

You're right.  But in addition to having the inability to recognizing the right time to trade a player, botching the Davis signing which probably means they couldn't sign Manny.