Jump to content

I'm already over this offseason.

Moose Milligan

By Moose Milligan
in Orioles Talk

 Share

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 643
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Days

Top Posters In This Topic

Popular Days

Popular Posts

Tony-OH
Tony-OH

Can I ask what you consider a "competitive team" to be in 2022. And what do you think it takes for a 110 loss team to become a competitive team in one season? How do they even do that? Who do you thin

Moose Milligan
Moose Milligan

Matz to the Cardinals, 4 years/44 million. That's Ubaldo money. That's Cobb money.  That's a contract this team easily could have afforded.  Even if they had to pay a little extra because we suck

owknows
owknows

I guess I really don't understand this reaction, or the desire to start accumulating the same kind of contracts that got us into this mess. Your post says it all really.. although maybe you didn'

Posted Images

NCRaven Hangout Grand Counsel

NCRaven

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Matt Boyd is a reason why you look to trade Means.  

Wish you would explain your statements made as fact.  Why?  Because he's a cautionary tale about pitcher injuries?  Or because he might be available to pitch in June, or later?  Or you really like a pitcher that will be 31, coming off an injury, and averaging 1.09 WAR (bRef) per year for his career?

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

Posted
Posted
16 minutes ago, NCRaven said:

Wish you would explain your statements made as fact.  Why?  Because he's a cautionary tale about pitcher injuries?  Or because he might be available to pitch in June, or later?  Or you really like a pitcher that will be 31, coming off an injury, and averaging 1.09 WAR (bRef) per year for his career?

Because they have some similarities in stats, age, injuries…and now that Boyd has gotten expensive, his team doesn’t want to pay him.

He was involved in trade talks for a while in the late 2010s but Detroit never pulled the trigger.  I bet they with they had now.  You now lost a player that was a real asset for you and you got nothing from him.

Thats the risk of holding onto these types of guys.  Sometimes this comes out of nowhere and it just kind of what it is but when there are signs of things that could be problematic, sometimes it’s best to make sure you get something for the player than not.

Personally, I think I likely am holding onto Means but Boyd does provide a cautionary tale as to why they shouldn’t.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
sportsfan8703 Hangout Grand Counsel

sportsfan8703

Posted
Posted
51 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

Because they have some similarities in stats, age, injuries…and now that Boyd has gotten expensive, his team doesn’t want to pay him.

He was involved in trade talks for a while in the late 2010s but Detroit never pulled the trigger.  I bet they with they had now.  You now lost a player that was a real asset for you and you got nothing from him.

Thats the risk of holding onto these types of guys.  Sometimes this comes out of nowhere and it just kind of what it is but when there are signs of things that could be problematic, sometimes it’s best to make sure you get something for the player than not.

Personally, I think I likely am holding onto Means but Boyd does provide a cautionary tale as to why they shouldn’t.

Also, it worked out in the sense that they held onto Boyd and now are ready to compete. However, pitchers get hurt all the time. So we could hold on to Means, and still be the wrong move. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
owknows All-Star

owknows

Posted
Posted
Just now, sportsfan8703 said:

Also, it worked out in the sense that they held onto Boyd and now are ready to compete. However, pitchers get hurt all the time. So we could hold on to Means, and still be the wrong move. 

Not if you have special knowledge and insight that comes from guessing on the internet.

You're always right on the internet..

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

Posted
Posted
6 minutes ago, sportsfan8703 said:

Also, it worked out in the sense that they held onto Boyd and now are ready to compete. However, pitchers get hurt all the time. So we could hold on to Means, and still be the wrong move. 

But they aren’t going to compete   WITH him unless they are able to bring him back at a cheaper price.  So, he isn’t helping with that.

And yes, pitchers do get hurt..especially those with a track record of it, ala Means..which is the point.

And sure, they could hold onto Means and it be the wrong move.  They could trade him and it be the wrong move.  You just have to go with the odds and do what you feel is best.  My guess is the offers for him won’t be enough to trade him.  I would gamble a little bit on him but that’s more because we need pitching although I would also be trying to do more to win sooner, so since that’s not the case, trading him now may make the most sense.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
NCRaven Hangout Grand Counsel

NCRaven

Posted
Posted

Means is two years younger than Boyd and just starting arbitration.  HIs injuries have been relatively minor and not required surgery or extended stays on the IL.  I have no problem with trading him if you get a good deal that makes the team better over the long term.  And, I have no problem keeping him if we don't get that offer.  The only obviously wrong answer would be to trade him for inferior players just to save on his first arb year salary.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

Posted
Posted
14 minutes ago, NCRaven said:

Means is two years younger than Boyd and just starting arbitration.  HIs injuries have been relatively minor and not required surgery or extended stays on the IL.  I have no problem with trading him if you get a good deal that makes the team better over the long term.  And, I have no problem keeping him if we don't get that offer.  The only obviously wrong answer would be to trade him for inferior players just to save on his first arb year salary.

But he is the age Boyd was when Boyd was pitching better.  
 

I agree with your last sentence.  I will say, as much as I worry about this team being cheap, I don’t think they will go that far.  Non tendering Santander is possible though and I think that would be a poor move.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
NCRaven Hangout Grand Counsel

NCRaven

Posted
Posted
4 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I agree with your last sentence.  I will say, as much as I worry about this team being cheap, I don’t think they will go that far.  Non tendering Santander is possible though and I think that would be a poor move.

I "think" (but who knows?) that they'll tender a contract to Santander, but, I could see Fry being non-tendered.  We have lots of young lefties that could take his role in the bullpen. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, NCRaven said:

I "think" (but who knows?) that they'll tender a contract to Santander, but, I could see Fry being non-tendered.  We have lots of young lefties that could take his role in the bullpen. 

I don’t disagree.  I would be upset if they non tender Fry…not because of that decision in a vacuum but because they held onto him at the deadline and Elias said trades weren’t made because they liked these guys and felt they could part of the next winning team.  If they go from thinking that in late July to thinking he’s not good enough to tender a contract, it shows incredibly flawed decision making and judgment by Elias.

Dont get me wrong, mistakes are made and evaluations can be wrong in the moment.  But he has seen Fry for a while now.  If he is going to allow w few awful months to change his mind that quickly, I think that’s a little worrisome.

Link to comment
Share on other sites
Sports Guy Hangout Grand Counsel

Sports Guy

Posted
Posted
11 minutes ago, Frobby said:

Wow, Steve Cohen isn’t fooling around.   

They had to do it to convince him to come back to the east coast.  He wanted to go out west.

Cohen is going to learn that you can’t buy a title though. 

Still, he has arguably the 2 best pitchers in baseball in his rotation now.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

×
 Share
Go to topic listing


  • Posts

    • Roll Tide
      Who will pay Burnes $400M this offseason?

      By Roll Tide · Posted

      WBALs Blair Young likes our chances https://www.wbaltv.com/article/do-orioles-have-chance-sign-free-agent-pitcher-corbin-burnes/62512129
    • Hallas
      Who will pay Burnes $400M this offseason?

      By Hallas · Posted

      Am I crazy for thinking Burnes isn't going to sniff Cole's deal?  I'm thinking like 7/260-280.  I don't think he's going to sniff Cole's deal.  For starters i dont think hes as good a pitcher as Cole was at the time of his signing.  Also, the Yankees aren't going to be in the bidding so that leaves the Mets, Giants, Nats, Orioles as teams that can afford him.  The Sox could too, but they're on the fringe of contention and might opt to develop more with the Yankees and Orioles solidly ahead of them in division.  Only the Mets from that list really seem like teams that would go over 300m for a pitcher, but they will be pressed for money because of the luxury tax.
    • casadeozo
      Who will pay Burnes $400M this offseason?

      By casadeozo · Posted

      Agree a strong RHP bullpen arm that misses bats would be good to add. Looking at Spotrac I don’t see who it would be. Dominguez could certainly be someone that could fill this role. 
    • 24fps
      I love this team, I love the Orioles

      By 24fps · Posted

      Definitely leave the flag up. 
    • 24fps
      O's target? Roki Sasaki

      By 24fps · Posted

      It looks like I misread your post as being about last offseason instead of the 2017-2018 offseason.  My mistake, but does that in any way affect my overall point - you know the part that I made explicit and you left out of your response - that all the old, reflexive Angelosian nonsense no longer automatically applies? I'm unclear on what you're driving at, especially if I have to go back to the 2017-2018 offseason when Peter Angelos might still have been giving input on running the team.  I think it's a stretch to try to draw parallels to those days, or even the John Angelos years, to David Rubenstein potential as an owner.
    • Orioles West
      I love this team, I love the Orioles

      By Orioles West · Posted

      Irsay stealing the Colts in a midnight sneak away is in my top five depressing B-More moments, as well as the dreaded We Are Family Pirates in the ‘79 series. Otherwise, it’s a good bad list.
    • Orioles West
      I love this team, I love the Orioles

      By Orioles West · Posted

      I forgot the name of the movie, but Jimmy Fallon was playing a BoSox superfan (tough role for an NY kid) and it was during the era of the ‘curse’ (right at the end of it actually) — a kid he was coaching asked, “What have the Red Sox ever done for you?” His character didn’t have an answer. But it made me think. The movie was out during the 14-years of losing seasons. I asked myself the same question about whether a lifetime of fandom was worth it. For me, outside of my family - 15 generations or more on the Eastern Shore - the O’s are also part of my DNA.  Win, lose, lose horribly, lose ugly, bad ownership, they just can’t shake me. All that said, I totally understand the frustration. It will take me a little longer to heal from this ugly exit to 2024.

  • Popular Contributors

×
×
  • Create New...