Angelos Claims He's Not Selling

[Sports Guy]

39 minutes ago, panick said:

Frobby asked and now I'm asking. How do you know fans won't be going to games this year?

I don’t think there has been a big bump in season ticket sales.

[Jagwar]

1 hour ago, Going Underground said:

The revitalization started way before Angelos and Moore. Been about eight years or even longer on the vision. Pushed back a few years because of Covid. Starting to built up but a long way to go. Baltimore Arena or whatever you call it redone and ready to go in April. TopGolf open and doing really well so far. Paramount music establishment opening in June or July. Hotel ,sports bars and other restaurants still a few years off.

I miss Harborplace in all it's original glory. So many awesome memories there. 

[baloriole4]

5 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

I don’t think there has been a big bump in season ticket sales.

I agree.  IF there was big bump in season ticket sales, the team would be out gloating about it and promoting that.   The fact that they have been eerily silent on how season tickets are selling (let alone how all tickets are selling) is telling. 

The games last year (in an exciting season) that sold really well were those games with cheap priced tickets ($4/$8 offers) and/or multiple promotions.  Some of the Saturday games with big crowds had 2 or 3 major promotions going on at the same time such as the deeply discount tickets + a bobblehead + a pre/post game event 

[baloriole4]

On 2/19/2023 at 2:53 PM, owknows said:

For what it's worth, there isn't a thing wrong with criticizing the actions of a sports franchise. Or the actions of a sports franchise owner. But that's something considerably different than criticizing the person in obnoxiously caustic terms.

The most vocal critics of John Angelos don't know him. At best, they're guys who tell us they know a guy who knows a guy (which is obviously just tired BS).

At worst, they know nothing. Not of the individual. Not of the individual's finances. Not of the individual's life.

But they tell us nevertheless how certain they are that he's a despicable human being. That his works of charity are a farce. That he's Scrooge McDuck, flipping you the double bird while diving into piles of gold coins while refusing to make them happy by buying the free agents they covet.

The anonymity of the internet makes for some peculiar pathologies.

It's kinda sad really.

 

Cal Perry, is that you?

[glenn__davis]

11 hours ago, Going Underground said:

Interesting survey.Also saw one about 16 and 17 year old not getting their drivers license like they used to in the good old days when cars had rumble seats and fins.

 

Interesting indeed.  I see it with my kids and their peers as well, they're not nearly as into sports and my friends and I were as kids.  Just a very small sample size there of course but completely tracks with the article you posted.

Youtubers/Tik-Tok-ers are the new sports stars.  It's quite depressing really.

[Going Underground]

1 hour ago, glenn__davis said:

Interesting indeed.  I see it with my kids and their peers as well, they're not nearly as into sports and my friends and I were as kids.  Just a very small sample size there of course but completely tracks with the article you posted.

Youtubers/Tik-Tok-ers are the new sports stars.  It's quite depressing really.

My nephews are early 20's and they like to follow certain players and now into the betting thing. They could care less about a specific team.

[Frobby]

1 hour ago, glenn__davis said:

Interesting indeed.  I see it with my kids and their peers as well, they're not nearly as into sports and my friends and I were as kids.  Just a very small sample size there of course but completely tracks with the article you posted.

Youtubers/Tik-Tok-ers are the new sports stars.  It's quite depressing really.

Maybe being less invested in professional sports is a healthy thing for society.  Sometimes I’ll be in a really bad mood after the Orioles lose and think to myself, “why is my personal happiness affected by the performance of a bunch of random guys 35-40 years younger than me who I’ve never met and have no connection to me whatsoever?”   Then I go back to brooding about the loss.   

[Sports Guy]

7 hours ago, baloriole4 said:

I agree.  IF there was big bump in season ticket sales, the team would be out gloating about it and promoting that.   The fact that they have been eerily silent on how season tickets are selling (let alone how all tickets are selling) is telling. 

The games last year (in an exciting season) that sold really well were those games with cheap priced tickets ($4/$8 offers) and/or multiple promotions.  Some of the Saturday games with big crowds had 2 or 3 major promotions going on at the same time such as the deeply discount tickets + a bobblehead + a pre/post game event 

I also got 8 opening day tickets with relative ease. That never used to be the case.

 

And you see so many people on social media that always ask, why should I get season tickets? Tons of seats are always available to basically any game I want to go to.

Edited February 21, 2023 by Sports Guy

[Frobby]

40 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

I also got 8 opening day tickets with relative ease. That never used to be the case.

 

And you see so many people on social media that always ask, why should I get season tickets? Tons of seats are always available to basically any game I want to go to.

I’ve been part of a ticket group since a couple of years after Camden Yards opened (and was in another one the first few years).   We almost broke up this winter when the long-time organizer of the group decided to give it up, and I was ready to move on and go game-by-game.  But another group member stepped up to run the group and I decided to stay in.   Honestly, if the team had sucked again last season I would have given up the tickets, but the lure of having good seats for possible playoff games, plus not paying service fees on my tickets, was enough to keep me in.  So, it’s eight games for me, plus any others I decide to pick up.   

[Sports Guy]

1 minute ago, Frobby said:

I’ve been part of a ticket group since a couple of years after Camden Yards opened (and was in another one the first few years).   We almost broke up this winter when the long-time organizer of the group decided to give it up, and I was ready to move on and go game-by-game.  But another group member stepped up to run the group and I decided to stay in.   Honestly, if the team had sucked again last season I would have given up the tickets, but the lure of having good seats for possible playoff games, plus not paying service fees on my tickets, was enough to keep me in.  So, it’s eight games for me, plus any others I decide to pick up.   

But see that’s just it. The Os didn’t do anything this offseason to “grab you”.

We have to remember, most fans out there are casual fans. They want a reason, a real reason, to spend 1000s of dollars on tickets for a baseball team.

What did the Os provide to give that reason?

Even if you love what they are doing and you are excited for the young talent they have, which we all are, why spend the money on season tickets when you can pick and choose?

It used to be you do it for Opening Day and, as you said, the playoffs.

OD tickets are no longer as difficult to come by and the playoffs aren’t in people’s minds right now because it’s not all that realistic as of today.

 

[Frobby]

9 minutes ago, Sports Guy said:

But see that’s just it. The Os didn’t do anything this offseason to “grab you”.

We have to remember, most fans out there are casual fans. They want a reason, a real reason, to spend 1000s of dollars on tickets for a baseball team.

What did the Os provide to give that reason?

Even if you love what they are doing and you are excited for the young talent they have, which we all are, why spend the money on season tickets when you can pick and choose?

It used to be you do it for Opening Day and, as you said, the playoffs.

OD tickets are no longer as difficult to come by and the playoffs aren’t in people’s minds right now because it’s not all that realistic as of today.

 

I don’t disagree, but it’s not like increased attendance pays for that much salary.   Let’s say the O’s had picked up some $20 mm/yr free agent.  It would take an attendance increase of maybe 400,000 fans to pay for that (assuming $50 revenue per fan).   

In a way, the whole idea that the O’s will increase payroll when attendance supports it is a bit of a fallacy.  First of all, they could afford a big payroll increase now with no increase in attendance whatsoever.  Second of all, profits from increased attendance won’t keep up with payroll increases.   So yes, increased attendance is helpful and important, but it’s not the only factor in planning payroll.   
 

[glenn__davis]

1 hour ago, Going Underground said:

My nephews are early 20's and they like to follow certain players and now into the betting thing. They could care less about a specific team.

Yeah the gambling thing, much as I hate how much it has taken over sports talk, will keep interest for quite a while here I believe.

[glenn__davis]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

Maybe being less invested in professional sports is a healthy thing for society.  Sometimes I’ll be in a really bad mood after the Orioles lose and think to myself, “why is my personal happiness affected by the performance of a bunch of random guys 35-40 years younger than me who I’ve never met and have no connection to me whatsoever?”   Then I go back to brooding about the loss.   

I have had those exact thoughts many, many times.  I've wondered if as society evolves if sports fanaticism will begin to be a thing of the past.  I don't think we're there yet, but in 20-30 years, not sure what it will look like.  Major college sports I believe will be gone by then or at the least very very different.  Baseball continues to struggle to attract younger viewers.  The NFL with the combo of gambling and fantasy football appears to still be steamrolling along.

Edited February 21, 2023 by glenn__davis

[eddie83]

The skybox revenue is something as well. You see some games even last year where some boxes were empty. Plus the premium seating around home plate. 
 

I wonder how many businesses from DC market had skybox/premium seats when stadium opened? How well do the  Orioles do with Baltimore businesses compared to other clubs?

[eddie83]

1 hour ago, Frobby said:

Maybe being less invested in professional sports is a healthy thing for society.  Sometimes I’ll be in a really bad mood after the Orioles lose and think to myself, “why is my personal happiness affected by the performance of a bunch of random guys 35-40 years younger than me who I’ve never met and have no connection to me whatsoever?”   Then I go back to brooding about the loss.   

 

4 minutes ago, glenn__davis said:

I have had those exact thoughts many, many times.  I've wondered if as society evolves if sports fanaticism will begin to be a thing of the past.  I don't think we're there yet, but in 20-30 years, not sure what it will look like.  Major college sports I believe will be gone by then or at the least very very different.  Baseball continues to struggle to attract younger viewers.  The NFL with the combo of gambling and fantasy football appears to still be steamrolling along.

Same for me. I am much better about it then when I was younger. 
 

College football will roll along. Basketball concerns me. So many transfers.