I know nobody wants to hear this but......

[dystopia]

9 hours ago, Philip said:

Trading Drew Rom for Flaherty was not a big swing. It was trading a maybe prospect for a “hope he’s ok” guy with three months before FA.

I am increasingly convinced Mike won’t make any bigger move this season, and what we have is basically what we will have.

The trade deadline is a while freaking month from now, plus a few more days. I know it’s hard to believe because this board can’t go thirty minutes without discussing a trade and the Trade Deadline thread was created a long time ago (lol) but come on. Why are you convinced Elias will do nothing? Angelos is gone. There’s no reason to expect he will have to go to Ollie’s Bargain Outlet this time. 
 

 

[Orioles0615]

1 hour ago, e16bball said:

If only they’d traded for an unquestioned ace and signed an accomplished closer to address the injuries to Bradish and Bautista.

They’d probably be WS contenders if they’d done that.

They needed to upgrade the the starting rotation regardless. Do they get Burnes if Bradish isn't injured? Probably not.  Accomplished closer is great, pat on the back for Kimbrel, they don't need someone who was great in the past, he is not effective as he was and sure as hell can't be trusted in the playoffs. They needed anther bullpen arm, Elias didn't do it. He effectively just used Burnes to replace Bradish, who had a better year last year than Burnes.  

 

[Uli2001]

9 hours ago, now said:

I've been a fan for a long time too but mostly remember a lot of near misses, not tailspin collapses. 2005 comes to mind (Raffygate, Sammy Sosa, Lee Mazzilli, et al.)... what other seasons are you thinking of, to create scar tissue?

Were you around for 4-32?

[now]

9 minutes ago, Uli2001 said:

Were you around for 4-32?

Yeah that was pretty epic, even for an already losing season. Or were they barely in contention? I conveniently can't remember. 2017? Nope, but that was pretty bad too. After a 7-game win streak to the end of August, they were 8 games back, but then lost 22 of 29 to finish 18 games out.

[Philip]

1 hour ago, O's84 said:

Never said it was a big swing, that's the point I was making.  This year he's gotta do better because this team is in desperate need of pitching.

Understood, but I wasn’t referring to your comment, but to his. He failed to get anyone useful.

[OsFanSinceThe80s]

7 minutes ago, now said:

Yeah that was pretty epic, even for an already losing season. Or were they barely in contention? I conveniently can't remember. 2017? Nope, but that was pretty bad too. After a 7-game win streak to the end of August, they were 8 games back, but then lost 22 of 29 to finish 18 games out.

The Orioles had clawed their way back to a .500 record preceding the 4-32 collapse in 2002. I went to the first game that kicked off the losing streak. Looking back at it now it was clearly fool's gold with that roster expecting them to be a good team.

But after several down year's O's fans were hungry for a winning team. Little did we know the wait last another decade.

[dystopia]

11 minutes ago, OsFanSinceThe80s said:

The Orioles had clawed their way back to a .500 record preceding the 4-32 collapse in 2002. I went to the first game that kicked off the losing streak. Looking back at it now it was clearly fool's gold with that roster expecting them to be a good team.

But after several down year's O's fans were hungry for a winning team. Little did we know the wait last another decade.

I thought the 4-32 was 2008 so I went it looked it up, looks like that one was “only” 6-28 after being 62-65 on Aug 20. No shortage of late season collapses for this club. 

[now]

Speaking of scar tissue, a review of our storied/checkered past shows an uglier picture than we like to recall...

St. Louis Browns 1902-1953: 52 years, 1 WS (1944), loss.
Baltimore Orioles 1954-1983: 30 years, 6 WS (3-3), plus 2 more ALCS losses.
Orioles 1984-2023: 40 years, 6 playoffs losses (1 WC, 2 ALDS, 3 ALCS).

[accinfo]

This Oriole team has much better talent.  Gunner Henderson, Jordan Westberg, Adley, Santander, Grayson, and Corbin Burnes don’t have a 4-32 streak in them.  Even if they fill the rest of the positions with OH posters.  I think a rotation of Burnes, Grayson, and Kremer as your top 3 is a better than 500 team the rest of the way at least.  The jury is out on Povich but if he pitches as well as he has the Orioles with this offense will have a good chance to win when he starts.  Is the team good enough to win it all?  They need help most likely.  One consistent starter and a couple of better arms in the bullpen.  This team is going to the playoffs.  To think they are not at this point is based on emotion and not anything else.  

[oriolediehard]

5 hours ago, e16bball said:

If only they’d traded for an unquestioned ace and signed an accomplished closer to address the injuries to Bradish and Bautista.

They’d probably be WS contenders if they’d done that.

Doing nothing won't win a WS.  

[OriolesMagic83]

2 hours ago, dystopia said:

I thought the 4-32 was 2008 so I went it looked it up, looks like that one was “only” 6-28 after being 62-65 on Aug 20. No shortage of late season collapses for this club. 

The thing is, they were never collapses after being good.  It was always a collapse from mediocrity to awfulness.  Didn't the O's in the "Dark Ages" have the official goal of reaching .500.  I can 't imagine that Elias has ever had a goal for the O's to be an average team.

[e16bball]

5 hours ago, Orioles0615 said:

They needed to upgrade the the starting rotation regardless. Do they get Burnes if Bradish isn't injured? Probably not.  Accomplished closer is great, pat on the back for Kimbrel, they don't need someone who was great in the past, he is not effective as he was and sure as hell can't be trusted in the playoffs. They needed anther bullpen arm, Elias didn't do it. He effectively just used Burnes to replace Bradish, who had a better year last year than Burnes.  

7 hours ago, Bemorewins said:

“Accomplished" wasn't the need. Since that is not what Bautista was before last season. What we needed was effective/very good since that is the void that Bautista left.

Of course Kimbrel didn’t “replace” Bautista — there’s maybe 2-4 dudes in all of baseball who can “replace” Bautista. The only one who appeared to be available in the offseason was Hader, so perhaps you feel we should have guaranteed him 5/$100M? I don’t know that that would have solved the problem, given his 3.79 ERA thus far. 

Kimbrel is a good pitcher. He’s not Bautista (once again, almost no one is), but he has a 2.63 ERA and metrics that roughly correspond. 

As for Bradish, they went out and made the single biggest move of the Elias regime not long after they learned he was hurt, to bolster the pitching. Perhaps they do the Burnes deal anyway (I would have), but I have little doubt that Bradish’s condition helped push them to pull the trigger, which they’ve been hesitant to do in the past.

 

I don’t have a big problem with saying they didn’t sufficiently address the pitching staff as a whole, in terms of adding enough depth that they’d be fully covered in any conceivable disaster scenario (such as the one we’re in presently). But when you say they knew about those two injuries and just didn’t address them — when they added Craig Kimbrel and Corbin Burnes, two proven pitchers with a combined 2.41 ERA this year, in direct response to those two losses — I really can’t agree with that. You wanted them to do more than just address those losses, and that’s fine. But they did address them.