Gunner and Adley

[Baseball fandom]

Is it me or has others noticed that people haven't been screaming for extensions for these two the past couple of months like we were hearing prior to them slumping. I'm interested in hearing what you guys think? Are you still interested in big extensions for these two right now or are you at a wait and see approach  at this point.  .Thoughts? 

Edited August 26 by Baseball fandom

[ORIOLE33]

Gunnar definitely, but Adley, I would be cautious about giving a huge extension to. 

[Gurgi]

Spoiler

 

Well Adley cant throw anyone out and goes into month long slumps.  And Gunnar has been pretty awful on defense.  Or at least his defense went on a six week mega suck fest.  

Play them till their contracts are up and trade them for prospects.  

[OriolesMagic83]

I wonder if it's too late to extend Gunnar already.  Boras has already indicated it will take an extension w/ a value relative to the value of the franchise.  Obviously not the cost of the franchise, but a considerable chunk of the cost.  Never underestimate the demands of Boras.

[HowAboutThat]

Bobby Witt got one quickly. It is probably too late for either one, but I’d still want each into his 30s, if possible.

[Too Tall]

Right now, I'd just like both to go on an extended hitting streak. That's the extension I'd like to see? 

[Sports Guy]

Gunnar (and Holliday) yes

Adley…I don’t think so. 
 

I have wanted to give Adley one in the past but was always worried about it. Seeing too many signs from him now that worry me about where he will be 6-8 years from now. I think we will hear some stuff this offseason about injuries and what not that he is battling through.

But honestly, it’s not the offense. I know he has been struggling but I think it has more to do with health. But his defense has been atrocious outside of blocking balls.

I have never really felt he called a good game (to whatever extent catchers even call a game anymore) but now the framing is bad and hes struggling with the run game.

And this was before the time period where we wonder if he’s hurt. 
 

I have never felt his offense was good enough to be a full time first base/DH guy, so if the defense is already declining now, where is it going to be in 3-5 years, much less 6-8?

maybe it’s just a bad year. That happens. Guys have off years and then bounce back and play great but a guy like Posey, from 2010 through 2017, didn’t have an fWAR worse than 3.9 in any full season (only had 185 PA in 2011) and that was his rookie season. His next lowest in that time frame was 4.9.  It’s apparent that Adley isn’t Posey, so should he really get money close to him?

[Warehouse]

8 hours ago, OriolesMagic83 said:

I wonder if it's too late to extend Gunnar already.  Boras has already indicated it will take an extension w/ a value relative to the value of the franchise.  Obviously not the cost of the franchise, but a considerable chunk of the cost.  Never underestimate the demands of Boras.

Boras rarely extends his players and generally prefers for them to reach FA and test the market. Boras has never extended a player until they have reached the offseason after surpassing two years of service time - and that Carlos Gonzalez extension was over 13 years ago.  

Most of his rare extensions come in arb years - usually the final year.

Boras refers to early year extensions as “‘snuff contracts”.

In this context, it’s hard to say it’s too late.  If anything, it is too early. Most likely though, Gunnar, Jackson, and Westy will prefer to test free agency given their choice of agent. Extending any of these players will require a king’s ransom. 

[Just Regular]

Perhaps Adley in the long arc of his career is playing himself to a Buy Low moment this winter.

I've somewhat been on Team Adley as obtaining his 2028 and beyond adds a year with the entire group.    Basallo at AAA is the last big piece as I don't much expect EBJ to give us more than Mullins has the last ~4 years.

We'll see how frisky Rubenstein encourages Elias to be this winter - a Core Player extension does feel like the PR tonic to chase the taste of Burnes and Santander going before Opening Day 2025.

The Boras Client List - it will probably be the Chris Davis-Aaron Judge retention path if it happens at all.     Scott and Mike Elias perhaps both know Jordan Westburg in '22 and '23 might have been a stronger play than Rougned Odor or Adam Frazier most of the year long, but for the market we're in and the ownership we had then.

[Frobby]

I think you’re not hearing about it because this is not the time of year that stuff happens, and there’s more immediate stuff relating to the team and the playoff race to discuss.   I guarantee it will be discussed ad nauseum once the season is over.  

[terpoh]

I could not understand not wanting to extend Gunnar.

[Moose Milligan]

Gunnar's OPS is .914, his OPS+ is 161.  So, yes.

Not sure about Adley right now.  I don't like the trend he's on.  I think next year will tell us who he really is as a player and what to expect going forward.

[Baseball fandom]

3 hours ago, Sports Guy said:

Gunnar (and Holliday) yes

Adley…I don’t think so. 
 

I have wanted to give Adley one in the past but was always worried about it. Seeing too many signs from him now that worry me about where he will be 6-8 years from now. I think we will hear some stuff this offseason about injuries and what not that he is battling through.

But honestly, it’s not the offense. I know he has been struggling but I think it has more to do with health. But his defense has been atrocious outside of blocking balls.

I have never really felt he called a good game (to whatever extent catchers even call a game anymore) but now the framing is bad and hes struggling with the run game.

And this was before the time period where we wonder if he’s hurt. 
 

I have never felt his offense was good enough to be a full time first base/DH guy, so if the defense is already declining now, where is it going to be in 3-5 years, much less 6-8?

maybe it’s just a bad year. That happens. Guys have off years and then bounce back and play great but a guy like Posey, from 2010 through 2017, didn’t have an fWAR worse than 3.9 in any full season (only had 185 PA in 2011) and that was his rookie season. His next lowest in that time frame was 4.9.  It’s apparent that Adley isn’t Posey, so should he really get money close to him?

Yeah unfortunately he's more Wieters then Posey or Mauer. It kind of sucks that the Orioles took what many thought were generational catchers and they may turn out just decent but nothing special. Shoot I take Salvi Perez numbers from him. If Perez played in NY or LA  we would hear so much more about him. 

[Sports Guy]

Just now, Baseball fandom said:

Yeah unfortunately he's more Wieters then Posey or Mauer. It kind of sucks that the Orioles took what many thought were generational catchers and they may turn out just decent but nothing special. Shoot I take Salvi Perez numbers from him. If Perez played in NY or LA  we would hear so much more about him. 

Yainer Diaz may be better. Contreras may be better. Even if he didn’t end up a generational talent, he still needs to be the best C in baseball. Good argument he was the last 2 years but not this year.

[foxfield]

All of this is tainted by the simple fact that these two are both straining some under the weight of supporting this team beset by injury. 
 

Late June Gunnar is right in the middle of the best player in baseball conversation and a top candidate for MVP. Since late June all of that has cooled. 
 

The question is do the Orioles still believe these guys are cornerstones. If they do, they make the effort to sign them. It really is that simple. 
 

I would extend both Gunnar and Adley but also Holliday. The deals would all be different. As Adley is already both older and playing a more physically taxing position. 
 

If either catches fire down the stretch it will likely determine the teams fate come October.