Hats off to AJ -- Once again a model of consistency

[evenparthrough9]

Jones has been a star by any reasonable definition. Just not a superstar.

Back to the point as to whether plate discipline is an innate ability versus a learned skill -- it's both, of course. But I think it's about 75% ability and 25% learned skill. Adam Jones can hit a ball harder than Nick Markakis. Nick Markakis can discern a ball from a strike better than Adam Jones. That's mostly just the abilities they have, IMO.

If it's on 25% learned skill, what are 95% of Latin players free swingers?

[OFFNY]

o

(SEPTEMBER 6th)

Adam Jones is the Orioles' nominee for the 2016 Roberto Clemente Award.

https://twitter.com/masnRoch/status/773189920567468032

[Phantom]

If it's on 25% learned skill, what are 95% of Latin players free swingers?

I'm going to need a source on this, before you crash your car into confirmation bias mountain.

[Frobby]

I'm going to need a source on this, before you crash your car into confirmation bias mountain.

You know, that was my original reaction as well, and of course, it is a gross exaggeration and generalization. However, if you look at the list of who swings most often at pitches outside the strike zone, Latin American players are disproportionately represented. http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=5&season=2016&month=0&season1=2016&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&sort=3,d

[Phantom]

You know, that was my original reaction as well, and of course, it is a gross exaggeration and generalization. However, if you look at the list of who swings most often at pitches outside the strike zone, Latin American players are disproportionately represented. http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=5&season=2016&month=0&season1=2016&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&sort=3,d

Are you sure you're not just underestimating the amount of Latin American players? I was much more surprised by the amount of African American players on that list. I mean, Carlos Santana is literally the best at this, and Jones is literally the worst, so I'll declare a win on small sample sizes and wait for someone to provide actual proof.

[Spy Fox]

You know, that was my original reaction as well, and of course, it is a gross exaggeration and generalization. However, if you look at the list of who swings most often at pitches outside the strike zone, Latin American players are disproportionately represented. http://www.fangraphs.com/leaders.aspx?pos=all&stats=bat&lg=all&qual=y&type=5&season=2016&month=0&season1=2016&ind=0&team=0&rost=0&age=0&filter=&players=0&sort=3,d

I was checking out some of the other columns in that chart. I knew Jones and Schoop were free swingers, but I didn't realize they were literally the two most swinging players in the league!

[Frobby]

Are you sure you're not just underestimating the amount of Latin American players? I was much more surprised by the amount of African American players on that list. I mean, Carlos Santana is literally the best at this, and Jones is literally the worst, so I'll declare a win on small sample sizes and wait for someone to provide actual proof.

By my count (and admittedly, I have not checked the country of origin of all these players), 19 of the top 30 players in O-swing % appear to be Latin American. I believe Latin Americans make up slightly less than 30% of major leaguers. http://www.sportsbusinessnews.com/node/26907 So, I think my statement is fair.

[Phantom]

By my count (and admittedly, I have not checked the country of origin of all these players), 19 of the top 30 players in O-swing % appear to be Latin American. I believe Latin Americans make up slightly less than 30% of major leaguers. http://www.sportsbusinessnews.com/node/26907 So, I think my statement is fair.

And 5 of them are African American, which is way more than the 8% of MLB players they represent.

Also I'd be hesitant to compare this list to the overall MLB makeup as players tend to improve in this statistic as their careers move on.

Regardless, there is no more problematic thing to do in statistics than make conclusions from small samples, so again I'll reserve judgement until I see further evidence.

[Frobby]

And 5 of them are African American, which is way more than the 8% of MLB players they represent.

Also I'd be hesitant to compare this list to the overall MLB makeup as players tend to improve in this statistic as their careers move on.

Regardless, there is no more problematic thing to do in statistics than make conclusions from small samples, so again I'll reserve judgement until I see further evidence.

Fine with me. It wasn't my argument; in fact, it was evenparthrough9's counterargument to my argument that a large part of plate discipline is innate ability rather than a learned skill.

[25 Nuggets]

Adam Jones has 221 career home runs, which is 31st on the active list - he has done so in 11 seasons (already!!) including six sraight with 25+.

Here are the current players with more home runs than Adam that are younger than he (August 1, 1985):

Jay Bruce (237)

Chris Davis (237)

Evan Longoria (236)

[OFFNY]

Adam Jones has 221 career home runs, which is 31st on the active list - he has done so in 11 seasons (already!!) including six straight with 25+.

Here are the current players with more home runs than Adam that are younger than he (August 1, 1985):

Jay Bruce (237)

Chris Davis (237)

Evan Longoria (236)

Technically it has been 11 seasons, but Jones has played 9 full seasons so far in his career, including 2016.

He only had 76 plate appearances in 2006, and 71 plate appearances in 2007.

If you subtract the 3 home runs that he hit in those 2 partial season of 2006 and 2007, Jones has hit 218 home runs in 9 full seasons ........ with 25 games still left to be played in 2016.

[25 Nuggets]

Similar batters through age 29

949 Andre Dawson*

943 Gus Bell

935 Reggie Smith

935 Vernon Wells

932 Dave Winfield*

932 Jack Clark

925 Harold Baines

924 Billy Williams*

921 Johnny Callison

919 Matt Kemp

That is a very good list of comparables and bodes fairly well for his aging process. Like Dawson, his highest (offensive) comp, I believe it's time next season to move Jones to RF.

[Babypowder]

Similar batters through age 29

949 Andre Dawson*

943 Gus Bell

935 Reggie Smith

935 Vernon Wells

932 Dave Winfield*

932 Jack Clark

925 Harold Baines

924 Billy Williams*

921 Johnny Callison

919 Matt Kemp

That is a very good list of comparables and bodes fairly well for his aging process. Like Dawson, his highest (offensive) comp, I believe it's time next season to move Jones to RF.

wRC+ the last 5 years:

127, 119, 116, 109, 104

Not a great trend going in to his 30s.

[25 Nuggets]

wRC+ the last 5 years:

127, 119, 116, 109, 104

Not a great trend going in to his 30s.

Aye; hopefully he doesn't go the way of Vernon Wells whose last good season was age 31.

[BohKnowsBmore]

And another bomb!

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