Building the 2018 team

[El Gordo]

I'd look at the likes of Cobb, Hellickson and Vargas in  SP FA. I'd trade Manny for young ML ready SP and sign Mustakas.. Give Hardy a one year stop gap contract at SS. For OF I'd look at Austin Jackson. Lorenzo Cain and Jay Bruce depending on what I had to spend.  

[Ohfan67]

37 minutes ago, FanSince88 said:

Just one extra "good" starting pitcher is not nearly enough.  We don't even have any passable AAA starting pitchers in our minor leagues, let alone a competent ML SP.  

We need at least 3, probably 4, additional major league competent starting pitchers next year if we want to content.  They don't have to be all-stars, just 4.5 ERA or lower.  However, that will cost $10 million AAV apiece.  

IF they wanted to sign two good to very good starting pitchers, then they would have the money to do this. I don't think they will, but the finances work. 

[wildcard]

12 minutes ago, FanSince88 said:

No, they weren't poor starters in 2016.  Gausman, Tillman, and Bundy weren't poor last year, they were at least league average.  Ubaldo and Gallardo were both below average but not "poor" (they were both replacement-level pitchers).  

By contrast, in 2017 Ubaldo is well below replacement level, Tillman is WAY below replacement level, and Gausman has cratered from 4.2 WAR in 2016 to just barely above replacement level.

You are nitpicking.   Gallardo was a poor starter last year with a 5.42 ERA,

  Jimenez was a disaster for most of the season and pitched well for a few weeks at the end of the season. He had a 7.06 ERA on July 28 when he was dropped from the rotation.   He reentered the rotation on August 26 and pitched well for 5 weeks.  Not so well in the wild card game.   He ended with a 5.44 ERA.  That qualifies as poor.

Miley has a 6.17 ERA in 11 starts after he was acquired. Very poor.

Wilson had a 5.67 ERA  as a starter in 13 starts before he was replaced. Very Poor

Wright had a 6.22 ERA as a starter in 12 starts before he was replaced Very Poor

Bundy was not a starter until July 17.   He did well for a while but had a 5.11 ERA in September/

Overall the O's were 13th in a 15 team AL in starting pitching with a 4.72 ERA,

That is the definition of poor.

[DirtyBird]

30 minutes ago, wildcard said:

Sure it does.

 

Nope. It's a play-in game. Baseball is a game about series. 

If you aren't in a playoff series, it's not really the playoffs.

[wildcard]

14 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

 

Nope. It's a play-in game. Baseball is a game about series. 

If you aren't in a playoff series, it's not really the playoffs.

MLB expanded the playoffs to 10 teams.  That  includes the 2nd wild card team.   

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/standings/postseason-picture/

The O;s were in the playoff last year.

[El Gordo]

1 minute ago, wildcard said:

MLB expanded the playoffs to 10 teams.  That  includes the 2nd wild card team.   

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/standings/postseason-picture/

The O;s were in the playoff last year.

What ever, they made it to the post season.

[DirtyBird]

Just now, wildcard said:

MLB expanded the playoffs to 10 teams.  That  includes the 2nd wild card team.   

http://mlb.mlb.com/mlb/standings/postseason-picture/

The O;s were in the playoff last year.

Looks like a play-in game to me.

[Aristotelian]

 

Just now, DirtyBird said:

Looks like a play-in game to me.

Play-in would be if two teams were tied for the second wild card. I agree, there is a certain gravitas to playing a full series versus just one and done, but wild card is postseason.

[gtown]

5 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

Looks like a play-in game to me.

I've heard that argument. You could argue that they didn't make a traditional playoff series, but you're really nitpicking the intent of the original post. The Orioles were playing meaningful baseball with a shot at it in game 163. 

[TradeAngelos]

The proper thing to do with the 2018 Orioles, and probably the 2019 Orioles.....would be to cut back payroll and do a mini (you'll notice that word MINI, not some scorched earth nonsense like most of the fans want) rebuild going younger in spots while locking up your 2 main long term stars you can rely on with market rate deals, being honest with the fans about how truly competitive they can be with the two behemoths back at the top of the divisions with loads of cash spent recently, and available now. That saved payroll would then be put in our back pocket to reallocate for 2020 and beyond to acquire the missing pieces. 

The problems with that are many. First of all the owner will have none of it, and we will trot out a 75 win team next year and beyond with the fans being sold a bill of goods as to how competitive they will be, just like the old days. 

Another problem of course, is that our fine owner will just pocket any saved money and it will disappear into the Angelos family bank account, never to be seen again and surely not spent when we actually need it and at a time where it would matter. 

So in summary, I predict a looong next couple years and probably beyond. There is no doubt in my mind that the edict from above will completely derail anything that was built or acquired the last 5 years, by being the stubborn old cheap shortsighted man our owner is. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[eddie83]

53 minutes ago, DirtyBird said:

Looks like a play-in game to me.

So if they were swept by Toronto in a best of 5, 3 games to 0 then in your eyes they made the playoffs? So if baseball expands the WC to a best of whatever that changes it? 

This makes no sense, regardless of it is a best of 1,3,5 or 7 they made the playoffs. 

[Can_of_corn]

1 hour ago, DirtyBird said:

 

Nope. It's a play-in game. Baseball is a game about series. 

If you aren't in a playoff series, it's not really the playoffs.

A play-in game counts as a regular season game with regards to records.

The wild card game counts as a playoff game with regards to records.

It's a playoff game.

[eddie83]

Just now, Can_of_corn said:

A play-in game counts as a regular season game with regards to records.

The wild card game counts as a playoff game with regards to records.

It's a playoff game.

And regardless of how long or short it is there is a winner and loser. 

[Frobby]

3 hours ago, FanSince88 said:

Just one extra "good" starting pitcher is not nearly enough.  We don't even have any passable AAA starting pitchers in our minor leagues, let alone a competent ML SP.  

We need at least 3, probably 4, additional major league competent starting pitchers next year if we want to content.  They don't have to be all-stars, just 4.5 ERA or lower.  However, that will cost $10 million AAV apiece.  

It's so hard to know how pitchers will perform.    Chen, Gonzalez and Hammel all produced sub 4.50 ERA's in 2012 and cost a fraction of what Ubaldo cost.   There's a fair amount of random luck involved at times.     

[weams]

10 hours ago, eddie83 said:

I am going to go with the assumption Manny is not dealt. Even if this season was going well they had to know going into next year that 3 spots were open in the rotation for 2018. 

The position player needs are SS, C and a corner OF spot. By far the biggest need to me is SS. Sisco is close and even if he isn't ready by the start of the season he should be soon after. We have no answers for SS unless Manny is moved over and they find a 3rd basemen. FA doesn't offer much. Who knows how good Hays will wind up being  but at least he is on the climb for OF down the road. 

I know around $60M is off the books but then after raises and arbitration that will eat some away. That said we should have some money. 

C -Joseph, ?

1B- Davis 

2nd- Schoop

SS -????

3rd -Manny

RF -Mancini unless moved to LF

CF -Jones

LF -???

DH-Trumbo 

Bench could have Rickard again with a new utility IF. 

SP

Gausman

Bundy 

3 Open spots 

RP

Britton

Brach

O'Day

Givens

Hart

Bleier

Castro 

The pen is the best healthy 7 I have seen this year. I believe Acquino is out of options so he would have to be in the running for some spot in the pen or as a number 5 starter. 

To me here is a golden opportunity to deal a guy like Britton to help fill some of the needs of this team. Brach as a possibility as well. Obviously not having one or both for 2018 hurts next season but it isn't a death sentence either. I don't see ownership blowing things up too dramatically and right or wrong I think they will try to compete next year. I keep thinking about the Dodgers. Big market team, no title since 1988, deep farm system. A 2 year combination of Britton and Jansen would be a monster. That team has been on the doorstep for years. They are built to win now. Certainly can deal pieces like Smith, Castillo, and Kim for small parts but if we want to really do something and at the same time not blow it up all the way Britton is the key.  I know he just got back from injury but he has some time here to show what he can do. I really hope ownership wakes up and sees the opportunity to strike here. Brach would get some talent back as well no question, but not as much. 

As I have said, if they are seven below at the break I think everyone, including Manny, should be traded with no regard to building a major league team for 2018.