John Angelos mentions expansion

[spiritof66]

I had thought for years that the unwieldy 30-team set up was temporary, and that there would soon be two teams added to reach 32. In MLB, as in other professional sports, there inherently is a strong inducement for the owners to expand: each new team is charged a large franchise fee, which the owners share without it costing them a dime, other than (a) the theoretical dilution of the quality of their product, and I have never seen anything to suggest that the owners care a whit about that, (b) having more mouths to feed from MLB-wide revenues, including TV, cable and internet fees, (c) the potential embarrassment to MLB of failing in the expansion city and (d) in the worst case, the cost of bailing out financially a failed team.  I kind of looked forward to the discussion about realignment and interleague play that 32 teams would probably lead to. 

Two factors are delaying, and apparently will continue for years to delay, expansion.  (There may be others, but these are the two I've read about, and they make sense to me.) One is the fact that two existing franchises, Tampa and Oakland, are having serious difficulties. MLB tends to equate a troubled franchise with a bad stadium, and the panacea for a franchise's  problems is a shiny new stadium. -- it can't be that MLB made a mistake putting a franchise there. While there other ways to look at their problems, the Rays and A's do have baseball's worst stadiums, and there has been no solution to the stadium predicament of either team after years of trying.

MLB and the owners do not want existing franchises to relocate for lots of reasons. One is that the relocation will remove the new city from the list of available expansion sites, potentially reducing the franchise fees they will share. At the same time, the owners and MLB  recognize that at some point a team's situation becomes untenable and there has to be a move. MLB appears to have decided that Oakland and Tampa Bay should have first dibs on cities that don't have ML franchises, to be used in the event they can't get the new facilities that, it's assumed, will turn their teams around. Commissioner Manfred has been pretty clear that there should be no expansion (removing those cities from the Rays' and A's' relocation options) until there's a final decision as to whether those two teams can find a way to get better facilities.

https://www.cbssports.com/mlb/news/mlb-expansion-wont-happen-right-away-but-rob-manfred-has-three-cities-in-mind/

While that makes sense, the problem for MLB is that the Tampa Bay and East Bay situations are very complicated politically, logistically and financially.  In both cases, there has long been recognition of the need for a new stadium but no way defined toward deciding what to do about it (including where to build and how to pay for it). And, while there's been some  recent progress in at least defining some options in Oakland, it remains unclear as to when they will be resolved. If expansion remains on hold until then. it could be on hold for a long time -- and, in the meantime, potential expansion targets are committing to stadiums and arenas for other sports. Vigorous and effective leadership might be able to meet that challenge, but baseball has Rob Manfred instead.

Second, there is a dearth of cities clamoring for a franchise as to which the risk of an MLB franchise's failure is pretty low. Part of the problem is that the public and even many politicians have been educated over the past decade or so as to the virtual theft of public funds perpetrated by professional sports teams in building stadiums, and the limited economic benefits of  new teams and stadiums. As a result, cities and counties are less willing to open up the purse strings to pay for land acquisition and construction of stadiums. 

According to the article linked above, Mighty Manfred recently mentioned three leading candidates for expansion: Charlotte, Mexico City "or some place in Mexico," and Montreal.

There are real problems with Mexico City (which at an altitude of about 7,400 feet is about 1,700 feet higher than Denver), and the other south-of-the-wall suggestions I've seen, Guadalajara and Monterrey, don't seem promising. The Expos debacle and the relative dearth of large corporate presences are likely to make MLB owners wary about going back there. Charlotte makes a lot of sense, but there is a stadium problem: the city recently built a 10,000-seat MiL stadium that apparently can't be expanded, ignoring in that process arguments that it should wait until its prospects for MLB expansion got better defined, and is now considering a new soccer venue. 

http://www.charlottemagazine.com/Charlotte-Magazine/July-2017/Charlotte-Wont-Get-Major-League-Baseball-Anytime-Soon/

Other possibilities include Portland,  San Antonio, Las Vegas, San Juan (I think we can put that one aside for a while) and Nashville. I know a little about Las Vegas and San Antonio, and neither strikes me as an attractive expansion target. I don't know why Vancouver isn't discussed, but it doesn't seem to be in the picture as far as I can tell. 

http://www.sportingnews.com/mlb/list/mlb-worst-contracts-war-value-2017-matt-wieters-albert-pujols-adrian-gonzalez-danny-espinosa/10lgu7p7dcbaz1a0uyklgyx04t

The point is that, even if the Rays and A's don't grab one or two of these cities, there aren't places clamoring -- and nearly ready, with a new stadium or plans in place -- for a team that is pretty certain to be a financial success.  I think we'll be stuck at 30 teams for the next six or eight years, anyway.

[weams]

1 hour ago, Tony-OH said:

I don't think the talent level will allow for expansion as well as the fact that there are no areas ready for a MLB franchise in my mind. I'd rather expand the rosters to 27 with a limit of 12 pitchers on a roster. 

I think that requires a new CBA. But the coin of the realm would be a Pitcher who DHs. A Chris Davis type that soaks up 4 innings a week. 

[Can_of_corn]

1 hour ago, 24fps said:

What, has Florida forgotten about Jimmy Buffet?  One day back in the '70's when I was living in Sarasota, I swore I would kill something if I heard "Margaritaville" one more time.  Strangely it worked for a a while...

Notice I said classic rock stations?  Jimmy still holds sway with the easy listening crowd.

[Can_of_corn]

35 minutes ago, weams said:

I think that requires a new CBA. But the coin of the realm would be a Pitcher who DHs. A Chris Davis type that soaks up 4 innings a week. 

Brendan McKay?

[Ohfan67]

I think Mexico is totally out. They are teetering on the edge of becoming a narcostate/failed state and are likely to have serious problems for years. 

[weams]

Just now, Ohfan67 said:

I think Mexico is totally out. They are teetering on the edge of becoming a narcostate/failed state and are likely to have serious problems for years. 

Really? I had certainly heard otherwise. In fact.

But that is only opinion on my part.  I can see MLB playing there.  I could have seen them playing in Peurto Rico.  Or Japan. Definitely Montreal and in the NY/Boston Corridor. 

[weams]

21 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

Notice I said classic rock stations?  Jimmy still holds sway with the easy listening crowd.

He's good for day drinking. 

[Can_of_corn]

Just now, weams said:

He's good for day drinking. 

I certainly don't want to listen to him when I'm sober.

[Going Underground]

6 minutes ago, Can_of_corn said:

I certainly don't want to listen to him when I'm sober.

I heard you got up early and was first in line for this?

 

https://blog.margaritaville.com/2017/07/margaritaville-park-tampa-bay-rays/

 

 

This is scary. 

 

[Spy Fox]

30 minutes ago, weams said:

Really? I had certainly heard otherwise. In fact.

But that is only opinion on my part.  I can see MLB playing there.  I could have seen them playing in Peurto Rico.  Or Japan. Definitely Montreal and in the NY/Boston Corridor. 

For a part of the new annual 12 day, 10 game, three-city, and two-hemisphere AL West trip!

[Tx Oriole]

5 hours ago, accinfo said:

I would think Nashville, Montreal, or Portland would be in the mix.

I am against adding more teams. 

[HokieOs]

I'm not in favor of adding more teams. Though a few teams should probably be relocated (I'm looking at you Tampa Bay).

I'd love to see Charlotte get a team (or the Rays). I know they just built their new minor league ballpark but what that has shown is that the city will support a team. They sell out many of their games while charging ticket prices that are far above the norm in AAA (tickets are about $20/seat even in the outfield and are closer to $30 for a good seat). The minor league park if I'm not mistaken CAN be expanded enough for temporary use (similar to what they would have done to Harbor Park if Norfolk got a team a decade ago), but for permanent use a new stadium would be required.

But I would assume at least one of the new teams will be outside of the United States (Mexico City perhaps?). Would Montreal get better support with a better stadium? Maybe even Vancouver?

[Ohfan67]

2 hours ago, weams said:

Really? I had certainly heard otherwise. In fact.

But that is only opinion on my part.  I can see MLB playing there.  I could have seen them playing in Peurto Rico.  Or Japan. Definitely Montreal and in the NY/Boston Corridor. 

Fact? The article you linked says the murder rate is falling and quotes a 2012 article as the source!! A rich young American  going clubbing in any of the cities that have been mentioned in this thread is a game of Russian roulette. I have many friends and colleagues who travel in the gulf states and northeast Mexico and the security situation is declining. The police at all levels are unbelievable corrupt. I can’t imagine MLB trying to place a team in Mexico. A couple f player lidnappings and a few fans killed on a highway at night and the team would be moving north quickly. You can check out the state Department travel warning here https://travel.state.gov/content/passports/en/alertswarnings/mexico-travel-warning.ht

[spiritof66]

On 9/26/2017 at 1:46 PM, Ohfan67 said:

I think Mexico is totally out. They are teetering on the edge of becoming a narcostate/failed state and are likely to have serious problems for years. 

Yeah. Apart from what the situation might be in Mexico City, or elsewhere in Mexico, at the time of a decision on expansion, I don't see how MLB can have confidence in safety and stability, or the financial health of ticket-buyers, for the long-term, and I'm sure they would be put off by the possibility of decisions about schedule disruptions or pulling the team out in the future. Just too much risk, I would think.

[24fps]

On 9/26/2017 at 0:52 PM, Can_of_corn said:

I certainly don't want to listen to him when I'm sober.

Of course not.  Back in the day listening to Jimmy Buffet sober just wasn't done.  You could do it, but would you ask Mike Trout to bunt with the bases loaded and down three runs?  

JB doesn't sound better if you've been drinking, he sounds right.